Testbench setup?

jimmyq · Oct 12, 2016

hi thanks for that extra and superb info i even rigged up the steering control module today lol only thing i have left is the bcm which was next on my list... i have a few mk7 clusters as i code them in etc and can remove cp via geko but i wanted a to set a rig up on my bench to experiment further and to power up clusters to check mileage on them etc without the need of a physical car as when i try them in a car have to code the original ones back etc ball ache... im going to try change the adaptations on a cluster then try it on the bench ps i get no ignition lights on the bench whatsoever as yet

DV52 · Oct 12, 2016

^^^^Jimmy: Please share any observations that you make - I'm very interested in your findings

Don

PS: If you want to sell a spare hex17 module and you are willing to accommodate the appalling FX exchange rate between our countries, please let me know!
PPS: If you have a yen to read more about cluster illumination in the mk7, HERE is a description from the deranged ramblings of a decrepit mind! It's purely a guess which is likely to be completely wrong, but which may provide an insight into what's happening inside the instrument module

Zenerdiode · Nov 20, 2016

Don, where did you get the female OBDII connector and lead? Did you use an RT OBDII extender - or get something more local?

Uwe · Nov 20, 2016

I'm not sure where Don got his, but we buy the ones we use for test setups here:
http://www.obd2cables.com/products/...nnector-shell-j1962f-w-2-tpa-locks-black.html

You would need some of these pins to go with 'em:
http://www.obd2cables.com/products/obd-connectors/j1962f-assembly/connector-terminal-j1962f.html

-Uwe-

DV52 · Nov 20, 2016

Zenerdiode said:
Don, where did you get the female OBDII connector and lead? Did you use an RT OBDII extender - or get something more local?

Zenerdiode: I'm sure that the units that Uwe recomends are of better quality, but I wasn't too fussed about quality for the test jig (it was a case of cheap-and-nasty will suffice). Purchased mine from eBay (see below). Alas supplier is China - but doubtless delivery to UK is quicker than to the distant continent that I live-on!

Don

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/OBD2-OBD...786896?hash=item41b282bd90:g:DncAAOSwi0RX0f2j

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/OBD2-OBD...b1c5d6b&pid=100005&rk=1&rkt=6&sd=282167786896

Zenerdiode · Nov 20, 2016

Thanks very much to both of you. :thanks:

ibis_white · Feb 7, 2017

Apologies for resurrecting an old thread, but I am stumped about what to do next. I have a testbed of an Audi MMI3GP main unit, screen, keyboard, gateway all connected to my VCDS cable. All seems to work OK, but I cannot play with the Bluetooth and WLAN which ask me to turn the ignition on.

The main unit has no terminal 15 connector, so I assume it gets ignition on messages through the MOST optical network. Reading through this thread I believe I need a J519 to produce these messages over the CAN bus to the gateway which connects to the main unit by the MOST??? My problem is how I connect up the power to the J519 in order to get it producing the ignition on messages.

Thanks,

Zenerdiode · Feb 7, 2017

This may be an occasion of having to swallow a bird to catch the spider, having swallowed the spider to catch the fly...

The T15 signal is distributed around the network from 19-CAN gateway, but in order for 19 to know to send it; it needs to have a message from 05-Access/Start Authorisation. Of course, this needs matched keys.

ibis_white · Feb 8, 2017

So you are saying that after eating the bird, spider and fly I'm stuffed ;-)

It does make sense that producing the ignition on messages needs to be controlled in some way. This is modern cars for you. I guess I'll have to do the Bluetooth/WLAN fiddling in the car.

Thank you for your reply.

DV52 · Feb 8, 2017

Zenerdiode: If you ever find an easy-to-use CAN message emulator that doesn't cost the annual budget for a small African nation - I'm all ears! It shouldn't be difficult to do with a PC , a DAC and an interfacing circuit!

Don

ibis_white · Feb 9, 2017

Don,

Using a Bluetooth OBD2 dongle and a terminal app on your phone or PC you can send and receive CAN messages. The ELM327 chip in the dongle does the complicated stuff of constructing and deconstructing the CAN packets. Back in 2015, I spent/wasted lots of time looking into this. I've also got a Sparkfun OBDII Uart which I used to log CAN bus traffic.

DV52 · Feb 9, 2017

ibis_white said:
Don,

Using a Bluetooth OBD2 dongle and a terminal app on your phone or PC you can send and receive CAN messages. The ELM327 chip in the dongle does the complicated stuff of constructing and deconstructing the CAN packets. Back in 2015, I spent/wasted lots of time looking into this. I've also got a Sparkfun OBDII Uart which I used to log CAN bus traffic.

ibis_white: Thanks for the response - I'm very interested to pursue your suggestion, can you provide specific info - please.

As for your discussion with zenerdiode (also interesting), I was wondering whether a way to defeat the T15 message signal from 05-Access/Start Authorisation module mightn't be to remove this module from the CAN Gateway list. I'm not familiar with Audi vehicles, but I'm assuming that not all Audi models have KESSY. If this is true, then my logic is that perhaps in those models without KESSY, the T15 signal might be generated by the steering wheel module (through the rotary switch that hangs off the back of key barrel). As I said, just an uninformed suggestion.

Don

Zenerdiode · Feb 9, 2017

DV52 said:
If you ever find an easy-to-use CAN message emulator...

I keep on looking every now and again. I had some links stored about 6 months ago - but can't seem to find them at the mo. Will probably start a new thread when (if) I find them.

Zenerdiode · Feb 9, 2017

Don, (and ibis_white) I made a big assumption that because we were talking MMI3G - that it was in a later model Audi. Speaking from a B8 (8K) Audi onwards, there's no rotary key barrel. Even if you don't have Audi Advanced Key (KESSY), the key blob is placed in a receptical and 05-Acces/Start Authorisation does the rest from there. 05 is really a phantom module as it is physically located in 46-BCM2.

mattylondon · Feb 10, 2017

Interesting thread!

I can only speak of the Audi A8. The KESSY is part of, as Zenerdiod said, the phantom 05-Acc/Start Auth. modul - which is actually 25-Immobilizer in the A8. A non-KESSY A8 still has modules 05 and 25 but will depend on a key in the ignition.

As for an easy to use CAN interface to send packets, I've had good success with a tool called CANalyst-II.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/282097513760?

ibis_white · Feb 12, 2017

For those who want to understand the data from CAN bus logging this is a great website:
http://jazdw.net/tp20

Even dusted off my old Sparkfun logger and had a another go myself.

DV52 · Feb 12, 2017

ibis_white: You are fast becoming my go-to "information mule" of choice (like a drug-mule, but not as financially rewarding and certainly not as clandestine, or illegal) for CAN data protocols!

Indeed an interesting site - but I have to restock my larder with my preferred alcoholic beverage - can't understand this stuff without a suitable lubricant to aid the synapses to fire!

thanks for the link

Don

rojas · Mar 5, 2017

i have this :RE

DV52 · Apr 11, 2017

Quick question -please: I'm contemplating getting the dashboard module (Instrument @ address hex17) on my test bench married - to the immo on one of the fob keys to my Golf mk7 (the real car). I can't find much reading material about this facet of MQB platform vehicles, but I understand (perhaps incorrectly) that the fob key has no internal link to a particular instrument module (it's just a dumb device -in this sense).

So - my question is: can a mk7 fob key be registered to several instrument modules (immobiliser V)- because I still want the key to work on my real car after it is registered to the instrument module on my test bench?

Don

Zenerdiode · Apr 12, 2017

DV52 said:
...but I understand (perhaps incorrectly) that the fob key has no internal link to a particular instrument module (it's just a dumb device -in this sense).

Quite the opposite Don, I'm afraid. The 'Cluster Code' (a series of about 7 bytes) gets written to the key when programming. Since about IMMO3 the chip in your key fob is program once only. It may be repeatedly programmed to the same cluster however, (when eradicating lost fobs for example) as the Cluster Code doesn't change.

My advice here is to get an identical cluster to the one in your car, learn as much as you can with it, do all of the naughty stuff with the EEPROM, then if you must, have a go with your live cluster in your car. Otherwise, read the 'TT Cluster Black Hole' thread. If you want to play, as well as getting a spare cluster, do some research on what kind of transponder is used in your keys - and buy them separately.

Testbench setup?

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