0W30 lubricants with 507.00 spec

Vasco Ferraz · Apr 9, 2017

(Not sure if this is the right place for this post. If not, please move it to the right section)

For a long time 504.00/507.00 (gasoline/diesel) oils were only available in the 5w30 viscosity.

However, recently I found that Shell, Mobil... are selling a 0W30 oil with the 507.00 spec.

Shell:
http://www.shell.com/motorist/oils-...hell-helix-ultra-professional-av-l-0w-30.html
Mobil:
http://www.mobil.com/english-GB/Passenger-Vehicle-Lube/pds/GLXXMobil-1-ESP-0W30

Where I live (Portugal) I don't have temperatures lower than -5ºC.

So my questions are:

- Knowing that I live in Portugal, will I benefit from using those 0w30 oils?

- Or these 0w30 oils more susceptible to break anything inside the engine?

- So, should I stick with the "Castrol Edge Titanium FST 5W-30 Long Life" for better engine/turbo durability?

My engine is the 1.9 TDI 77kW with DPF (code: BLS)

Thank you so much for your opinions

Eric · Apr 9, 2017

What's your driving habits? Mostly long trips fully warmed up, or short trips? How many kilometers do you put on the oil?

Vasco Ferraz · Apr 9, 2017

Eric said:
What's your driving habits? Mostly long trips fully warmed up, or short trips? How many kilometers do you put on the oil?

I use the Castrol FST 5W30 Long Life 504.00/507.00.

I replace it every 15k km.

I do 30000km per year mainly highway (99%).

I don't abuse the car and only go higher than 2000rpm when fully warmed.

My average speed is 120km/h (2000rpm) and on overtakes I can reach 140km/h.

My engine is the BLS. The one known to break conrods due to the low quality rod bearings.

Thanks!

Jack@European_Parts · Apr 9, 2017

I have found significant improvements from running a non synthetic & much heavier weight oil in these TDI's to stop ASH + a change of the oil every 5K and filter every 30K.

Deviating the crankcase vapors of blow by and EGR to the air filter box directly pre filtered & to be collected as a maintenance before it can become part of the combustion process is also recommended.

The reason the ROD bearings fatigue is not the design, it's the synthetic oil fails to seal the piston rings adequate and allows for excessive fuel contamination of the sump, this further hurts lubrication quality becoming as a result............ a solvent rather than a lubricant.

Extended oil changes is about the worst thing you can do and based on 2K RPM driving habits, you will not remove the contaminates adequately from the oil as part of the burn off process.

NostraJackAss Has Spoken!

Vasco Ferraz · Apr 9, 2017

Jack@European_Parts said:
I have found significant improvements from running a non synthetic & much heavier weight oil in these TDI's to stop ASH + a change of the oil every 5K and filter every 30K.

The engine code "BLS" has DPF meaning that I can only use 507.00 oils which are all 100% synthetic (and now the 0W30). Rule of thumb: follow the manufacturer rules.

Jack@European_Parts said:
Deviating the crankcase vapors of blow by and EGR to the air filter box directly pre filtered & to be collected as a maintenance before it can become part of the combustion process is also recommended.

Agree

Jack@European_Parts said:
The reason the ROD bearings fatigue is not the design, it's the synthetic oil fails to seal the piston rings adequate and allows for excessive fuel contamination of the sump, this further hurts lubrication quality becoming as a result............ a solvent rather than a lubricant.

I can't make opinions about fully synthetic oils falling to seal the piston rings.
But if this is true, I agree with you about the: "hurts lubrication quality becoming as a result a solvent rather than a lubricant".

Jack@European_Parts said:
Extended oil changes is about the worst thing you can do

"Castrol Edge Titanium FST 5W-30 Long Life" is design to last 50000km. Manufacturer says 30000km (depending on driving conditions it can be less). I change it in 15000km intervals.

Jack@European_Parts said:
and based on 2K RPM driving habits, you will not remove the contaminates adequately from the oil as part of the burn off process.

In Portugal the speed limit is 120km/h (2000rpm in my car). Once a week, when fully warmed, I drive 30km in 4th gear with higher rpm.

Thank you so much for your feedback

Vasco

Jack@European_Parts · Apr 9, 2017

"Castrol Edge Titanium FST 5W-30 Long Life" is design to last 50000km. Manufacturer says 30000km (depending on driving conditions it can be less). I change it in 15000km intervals.

This is a reasonable thing to think like this, however, if studying the level of contamination of the oil with fuel at anything over 5K is in my opinion reckless to the engine.

I'd rather drop the oil more frequent and for less money using SAE, while further netting a cleaner DPF and intake system because of it.

If you really want a lubrication system to work well within an engine, you remove the turbo charger from that oil system and isolate it with its own while recognizing the reasons oil breaks down.

Eric · Apr 10, 2017

I'm going to acknowledge Jack's answer and respectfully submit a more conventional one

Seeing how cold starts are such a small part of your routine, getting 0W instead of 5W isn't much of a factor. If this engine has rod bearing issues, I'd shoot for the thickest 30 you can find while staying with 504/507 approval (which does restrict you to 0W-30 and 5W30 grades, but with min HTHS of 3.5 which is pretty good). That being said the M1 0W-30 ESP looks like it might do the job. It's got 12.2 Cst@100*C, which is pretty high for the 30 grade (9.3 - 12.5), and I like the MB 229.51/52 approval which in some ways is more stringent than 504/507:

This way you wouldn't have to "choose" between optimal cold start protection and optimal warm operation viscosity. Oils with a higher VI (when you have more spread between cold and hot SAE grades) tend to degrade faster all other things being equal, but I don't think it's much of a factor if you're changing it at 15000km of highway duty.

Jack@European_Parts · Apr 10, 2017

I still think a 15 KM or 10K mile oil change is too long unless it is a nonstop type highway driving.

If traffic is considered for stop and go or local infrequency or how many actual cold starts are to be done would factor this for me.

In my case I live less than a mile from work, so I have to take my cars out to blow them out or change the oil........anything under 30 minutes of full operation temp is the same reason to change the oil as I aforementioned.

No matter what type of oil is used it can't resist fuel or water contamination from cold starts or low frequency driving short trips and most of all thickening agents don't work until at specified temperature of operation.

Keithuk · Apr 10, 2017

For the first 3 years I had my VW dealer service my Golf while its under warranty. Since then I've bought the parts from my dealer and serviced it myself. Last year when I went down for the part. They bought them out and the oil was 5W/40 Quantum Platinum 5 litre - ZGB 115 QLB 00 521 - £39. I said I've always had 5W/30 507.00. They said VW have changed the spec he doesn't know why.

There are many VW forums that talk about the correct oil to use. I said VW have changed the spec to 5W/40. Someone posted a PDF on Quantum Platinum which doesn't show 507.00.

https://quantum.thetradepartsspecialists.co.uk/uploads/78/ZGB115QLB00521_PDS.pdf

I will have a word with my dealer when I go down again.

Vasco Ferraz · Apr 10, 2017

Keithuk said:
For the first 3 years I had my VW dealer service my Golf while its under warranty. Since then I've bought the parts from my dealer and serviced it myself. Last year when I went down for the part. They bought them out and the oil was 5W/40 Quantum Platinum 5 litre - ZGB 115 QLB 00 521 - £39. I said I've always had 5W/30 507.00. They said VW have changed the spec he doesn't know why.

There are many VW forums that talk about the correct oil to use. I said VW have changed the spec to 5W/40. Someone posted a PDF on Quantum Platinum which doesn't show 507.00.

https://quantum.thetradepartsspecialists.co.uk/uploads/78/ZGB115QLB00521_PDS.pdf

I will have a word with my dealer when I go down again.

I am almost certain that there is no 5W40 oil with the 507.00 standard. Only 0W30 and 5W30.

The 5W40 (VW told you) is a 502.00/505.00/505.01. Not 504.00/507.00.

However, depending on your engine, you can use 502.00/505.00/505.01 or 504.00/507.00.

Regarding diesels, the 505.00/505.01 is used in vehicles without DPF. The 507.00 is (a longlife oil) used in in vehicles with DPF.

Jack@European_Parts · Apr 10, 2017

All engines consume more or less oil based on driving habits, geographic location, and the internal assembly of how it was fitted together.

Because pistons today are just shoved in with rings at a one size fits all......... gives great reflection of precession de-burring and measured hand fit tolerances to still be superior and why aviation & aerospace still use it!

Hand fitting a valve to valve stem or piston and rings to be "tight" takes time, however, for the right "owner" it is worth it for the winner of race, engine performance, longevity, and MPG.

It seems to be a dying art but one I hold dear to my heart from the great Nazis that taught me.

vreihen · Apr 16, 2017

Oops.....

http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/sc-motormouth-autos-0413-column.html

Shop should be on the hook for using wrong oil

Bob Weber
Chicago Tribune

Q: I just took my 2012 Audi A3 TDI for an oil and filter change at a nearby service station. The employees told me they use standard Mobil 1 oil and that this oil is fully compatible with my Audi/VW diesel engine. It was only after the fact that I thought to take a look at the Mobil 1 website, where it is indicated that Mobil 1 standard is not the recommended type of oil for my vehicle. What I've been unable to determine so far is whether "not recommended" means not ideal but will do the job — or does it mean, don't wait another day and go get the expensive synthetic oil replaced? The car is no longer under warranty. Later this year it will be sold back to Audi/VW under the buyback program. Thoughts?

— B.J., Philadelphia

A: "Audi is very particular about the type of oil that can be used in their vehicles, especially since this is a diesel. The regular Mobil 1 does not have a current diesel API rating and would not interact well with the Diesel Particulate Filter. This vehicle needs to be using the Mobil 1 ESP 5W-30, which is specially formulated to protect both the engine and the emissions system. I would replace the oil as soon as possible. If anything happens to the engine, we cannot warranty the oil," according to Jake Ackerman of ExxonMobil. Audi spokesperson Amelia Fine-Morrison said that "the vehicle in question … needs a low-ash synthetic, and therefore the Mobil 1 standard is not recommended. The shop should be held responsible for this error, and we recommend that the customer request that it is replaced with an approved product. While the replacement does not need to happen today, it should be replaced soon. For reference on approved oils, 504/507 oils are what are needed for the TDI engines, as stated in the owner's manual."

Vasco Ferraz · Apr 19, 2017

vreihen said:
Oops.....

http://www.chicagotribune.com/classified/automotive/sc-motormouth-autos-0413-column.html

Typical problem with an "all brands shop"... but not all.

Last time I had to change the oil in the shop I said a couple times to them:

"This car is Pump Duse, the injectors cables are embedded in engine oil, also it has DPF thus you must only use the 507.00 Castrol Edge." I am sure they used the right oil because I was stand next to my car.

vreihen · Apr 19, 2017

Vasco Ferraz said:
I am sure they used the right oil because I was stand next to my car.

When I take my car for an oil change, I bring the oil with me and ask for the empty bottles back. Since we now also do oil analysis on every vehicle in our home motor pool when we change the oil, I would have to include filling a sample bottle with the oil change routine if I ever change the oil in my car again.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing that sample report, since I'm probably 7 years overdue for a change based on elapsed time.....

0W30 lubricants with 507.00 spec

Vasco Ferraz

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