'07 Audi S6 5.2L V10 MAF sensor logging

dafrazi · Mar 3, 2014

Is there a way to log both MAF sensors at the same time so that I can see the air mass reading for each? I thought I could do this by logging blocks 77 & 78 through the 01-Engine controller but when graphed the air mass values are identical.

Santos · Mar 3, 2014

Can you post a complete autoscan from the vehicle?

Uwe · Mar 3, 2014

That engine has dual ECUs, no?

Are both MAFs connected to one of the ECUs, or is one sensor connected to each ECU?

-Uwe-

dafrazi · Mar 3, 2014

Autoscan is shown below.

The engine does have dual ECUs. I have logged the MAF sensors separately through each ECU but was curious if there was a way to see them side by side on the same log/graph. The logs I have show very similar readings for each MAF.

I have been struggling to eliminate this code "008569 - Bank 2; System Too Lean off Idle." I've smoke tested and checked the fuel pressure. No problems with either of those; so, it should MAF or O2 sensor related. I'm at the point of figuring out which of those it is.

Code:

Thursday,20,February,2014,21:53:40:53069
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator
VCDS Version: 12.12.0.0
Data version: 20130910


VIN: WAUGN94F87N081441   License Plate: 
Mileage: 108690km-67536mi   Repair Order: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 4F (4L0)
Scan: 01 02 03 05 07 08 09 0E 0F 11 31 15 16 17 19 36 37 42 46 47
          4F 52 53 55 56 61 62 65 67 6C 72 76 77

VIN: WAUGN94F87N081441   Mileage: 108690km/67536miles

00-Steering Angle Sensor -- Status: OK 0000
01-Engine -- Status: Malfunction 0010
02-Auto Trans -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
05-Acc/Start Auth. -- Status: OK 0000
07-Control Head -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
0E-Media Player 1 -- Status: OK 0000
0F-Digital Radio -- Status: Malfunction 0010
11-Engine II -- Status: OK 0000
31-Engine other -- Status: OK 0000
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
36-Seat Mem. Drvr -- Status: OK 0000
37-Navigation -- Status: Malfunction 0010
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: OK 0000
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
47-Sound System -- Status: OK 0000
4F-Centr. Electr. II -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
53-Parking Brake -- Status: OK 0000
55-Xenon Range -- Status: Malfunction 0010
56-Radio -- Status: OK 0000
61-Battery Regul. -- Status: OK 0000
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
65-Tire Pressure -- Status: OK 0000
67-Voice Control -- Status: OK 0000
6C-Back-up Cam. -- Status: OK 0000
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
76-Park Assist -- Status: OK 0000
77-Telephone -- Status: OK 0000
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No SW: 4F1 910 552 A    HW: 4F1 907 552 
   Component: 5.2L V10/4V FSI    ª0040  
   Revision: 59H09---    Serial number:               
   Coding: 01050009190F0160
   Shop #: WSC 05139 444 83890
   VCID: 224115C5FD00BC0EA27-8077

1 Fault Found:
008569 - Bank 2; System Too Lean off Idle 
               P2179 - 001 -  - MIL ON
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 11100001
                    Fault Priority: 0
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 255
                    Mileage: 108646 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.02.20
                    Time: 20:41:05

             Freeze Frame:
                    RPM: 2241 /min
                    Load: 31.4 %
                    Speed: 103.0 km/h
                    Temperature: 82.0°C
                    Temperature: 12.0°C
                    Absolute Pres.: 1000.0 mbar
                    Voltage: 13.462 V

Readiness: 0000 1100

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 09E-927-156.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F2 910 156 M    HW: 09E 927 156 C
   Component: AG6 09E 5,2 FSI USA 0030  
   Revision: --H01---    Serial number:        0096101
   Coding: 0000002
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 2F67ECF1BED201663D9-807A

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 4F0-910-517.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 517 P    HW: 4F0 614 517 P
   Component: ESP 8.0 quattro H05 0070  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 0020920
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 3163EA89A8E617962BD-8064

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth.        Labels: 4F0-910-852.clb
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 852 B    HW: 4F0 905 852 E
   Component: FBSAUDIC6 ELV   H07 0200  
   Revision: 00H07000    Serial number: 10603601926915
   Coding: 0000015
   Shop #: WSC 08259 444 12478
   VCID: 254B0ED9EC2E4B36C75-8070

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F0 910 131 L
   Component: FBSAUDIC6 EZS   H45 0080

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 4F0 910 335 
   Component: FBSAUDIC6 KSG   H27 0080

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head        Labels: 4F0-910-7xx-07-H.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 732 D    HW: 4E0 035 729 A
   Component: Interfacebox    H43 4140  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 361JJ067510242
   Coding: 0010003
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: 244D13DDE714B23ED0B-8071

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F0 910 609 E
   Component: Bedienteil MMIC6H01 0060

   Subsystem 2 - Serial number: 00000000563160

   Subsystem 3 - Serial number: 0124.10.060000000100011348ÿ

   Subsystem 4 - Serial number: 011348ÿ

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: 4F0-910-043.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 043 A    HW: 4F1 820 043 AG
   Component: KLIMABETAETIGUNGH30 0020  
   Revision: 00000052    Serial number: 00000030177900
   Coding: 0536618
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 1C3D2B3DDF648AFE68B-8049

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels: 4F0-910-279.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 279 J    HW: 4F0 907 279 A
   Component: ILM Fahrer      H15 0240  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 4F0907279     
   Coding: 0115123
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: 3065EF8DA3EC1E9E243-8065

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F1 910 113 C  Labels: 1KX-955-119.CLB
   Component: Wischer AudiC6  H05 0210  
   Coding: 00064784
   Shop #: WSC 02335  

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 4E0 910 557 A  Labels: 8K0-955-559.CLB
   Component: REGENLICHTSENSORH13 0090  
   Coding: 00146221
   Shop #: WSC 02335  

1 Fault Found:
02747 - Solenoid for Bi-Xenon Shutter; Right 
            011 - Open Circuit
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 01101011
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 132
                    Mileage: 108692 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.02.20
                    Time: 22:17:00


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 0E: Media Player 1        Labels: 4E0-910-111.lbl
   Part No SW: 4E0 910 110 C    HW: 4E0 035 110 A
   Component: MP3-Changer     H44 0350  
   Revision: 00044000    Serial number: AUZ5ZBF3109456
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 1835372D2B5CE6DE4C3-804D

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 0F: Digital Radio        Labels: 4E0-910-593-SIR.lbl
   Part No SW: 4E0 910 593 H    HW: 4E0 035 593 D
   Component: SDAR SIRIUS     H06 0080  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: AUZ4Z7F0010816
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 2C5DFBFD8FC47A7E18B-8079

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 11: Engine II        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No SW: 4F1 910 552 A    HW: 4F1 907 552 
   Component: 5.2L V10/4V FSI    ª0040  
   Revision: 59H09---    Serial number:               
   Coding: 01050009190F0160
   Shop #: WSC 05139 444 83890
   VCID: 224115C5FD00BC0EA27-8077

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: None
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 655 K    HW: 4F0 959 655 D
   Component: 7H AIRBAG AUDI8RH29 0400  
   Revision: 01H29000    Serial number: 003BMD000E7R  
   Coding: 0014152
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 2F67ECF1BED201663D9-807A

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F0 910 339 A
   Component: BF-Gewichtsens. H02 0050

   Subsystem 2 - Serial number: 6332CSME141A5B430

   Subsystem 3 - Serial number: 6342CSME133D5B367

   Subsystem 4 - Serial number: 6352QSME182D3649N

   Subsystem 5 - Serial number: 6362QSME1821392FJ

   Subsystem 6 - Serial number: 63734SME18021A3F+

   Subsystem 7 - Serial number: 63834SME192B2F6DI

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel        Labels: 4F0-910-549.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 549     HW: 4F0 953 549 A
   Component: Lenksäulenmodul H08 0230  
   Revision: 00H08000    Serial number: 90026062840470
   Coding: 0012141
   Shop #: WSC 02323 785 00200
   VCID: E6C9C9D5D1A8002E8EF-80B3

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
   Component: Lenkradmodul    H07 0090

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 4F0-910-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 930 C    HW: 4F0 920 980 Q
   Component: KOMBIINSTR. M73 H18 0120  
   Revision: 00700000    Serial number: 5H352WYA6     
   Coding: 2129268
   Shop #: WSC 08259 444 10288
   VCID: 234F10C1E21AB506A91-8076

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 4L0-910-468.lbl
   Part No SW: 4L0 910 468     HW: 4L0 907 468 
   Component: J533__Gateway   H06 0040  
   Revision: 00H06000    Serial number: 0900B06A29010F
   Coding: F5D5DEF7307A06
   Shop #: WSC 02334 785 00200
   VCID: ECDDBBFDCF443A7ED8B-80B9

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr        Labels: None
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 760     HW: 4F0 959 760 
   Component: Sitzmemory FS   H04 0050  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000000896400
   Coding: 0082954
   Shop #: WSC 02334 785 00200
   VCID: E1C3DAC9388667167BD-80B4

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation        Labels: 4E0-910-88x-37.lbl
   Part No SW: 4E0 910 888 D    HW: 4E0 919 887 L
   Component: MNS US          H48 0970  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 381JY067509652
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: 2F67ECF1BED201663D9-807A

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 42: Door Elect, Driver        Labels: 4F0-910-793-42.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 793 E    HW: 4F0 959 793 E
   Component: TSG FA          H12 0120  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: @‘
   Coding: 0051947
   Shop #: WSC 02327 785 00200
   VCID: 2C5DFBFD8FC47A7E18B-8079

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 4F0-910-289.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 289 G    HW: 4F0 907 289 G
   Component: Komfortgeraet   H22 0170  
   Revision: 01700022    Serial number: 01024261440000
   Coding: 4619293
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: 2E59F1F5B9D8086E36F-807B

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1K0 951 605 C
   Component: LIN BACKUP HORN H03 1301

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System        Labels: 4F0-910-223-BO.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 223 J    HW: 4F0 035 223 G
   Component: DSP-High C6     H10 0240  
   Revision: PROD_01     Serial number: 00000000001744
   Coding: 0000026
   Shop #: WSC 02323 785 00200
   VCID: 254B0ED9EC2E4B36C75-8070

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 4F: Centr. Electr. II        Labels: 4F0-910-280.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 280     HW: 4F0 907 280 B
   Component: ILM Beifahrer   H10 0080  
   Revision:             Serial number: 00000000054067
   Coding: 0012014
   Shop #: WSC 02323 785 00200
   VCID: DEB9E13509F858EE46F-808B

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 52: Door Elect, Pass.        Labels: 4F0-910-793-52.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 793 E    HW: 4F0 959 792 E
   Component: TSG BF          H12 0120  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: ˆ
   Coding: 0051947
   Shop #: WSC 02327 785 00200
   VCID: 2C5DFBFD8FC47A7E18B-8079

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 53: Parking Brake        Labels: 4F0-910-801.clb
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 801 C    HW: 4F0 907 801 A
   Component: EPB  CDEC0080   H04 0080  
   Revision: --H04---    
   Coding: 0008022
   Shop #: WSC 02324 785 00200
   VCID: 20451FCDF30CAE1EB43-8075

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 55: Xenon Range        Labels: 4F0-910-357.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 357 F    HW: 4F0 907 357 F
   Component: AFS 1           H01 0020  
   Revision: 00000001    Serial number:               
   Coding: 0000016
   Shop #: WSC 02325 785 00200
   VCID: 295302E980366F56E3D-807C

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F0 941 329 B
   Component: AFS-Modul links H02 0020

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 4F0 941 329 B
   Component: AFS-Modul rechtsH02 0020

1 Fault Found:
02627 - Dynamic Cornering Light Motor; Left (V318) 
            010 - Open or Short to Plus - MIL ON
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 11101010
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 102
                    Reset counter: 132
                    Mileage: 107912 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.02.01
                    Time: 19:00:40


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio        Labels: 4E0-910-541.lbl
   Part No SW: 4E0 910 541 Q    HW: 4F0 035 541 H
   Component: TUNER EU/US/RDW H42 0620  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 394K0067701869
   Coding: 0000002
   Shop #: WSC 02323 785 00200
   VCID: 2E59F1F5B9D8086E36F-807B

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 61: Battery Regul.        Labels: 4F0-910-181.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 181 E    HW: 4F0 915 181 A
   Component: J0644 BEM       H12 0590  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000000143133
   Shop #: WSC 05139 444 83890
   VCID: 234F10C1E21AB506A91-8076

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 4F0 915 105 D
   Component: von VA0  2611060103       
   Coding: 344630393135313035442056413032363131303630313033
   Shop #: WSC 05139 444 83890

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 62: Door, Rear Left        Labels: 4F0-910-795.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 795 E    HW: 4F0 959 795 E
   Component: TSG HL          H21 0050  
   Coding: 0051754
   Shop #: WSC 02327 785 00200
   VCID: 2E59F1F5B9D8086E36F-807B

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure        Labels: 4F0-910-273-BA.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 273 B    HW: 4F0 907 273 A
   Component: Reifendruck 3   H05 0100  
   Revision: 00050100    Serial number: 00000900035374
   Coding: 0062725
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: 224115C5FD00BC0EA27-8077

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 67: Voice Control        Labels: 4E0-910-75x-67.lbl
   Part No SW: 4E0 910 754 Q    HW: 4E0 035 753 A
   Component: SDS 3501 US     H45 0630  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000610200369
   Shop #: WSC 12336 024 394758
   VCID: 346DE39D57F422BE40B-8061

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 6C: Back-up Cam.        Labels: 4L0-910-441.clb
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 441     HW: 4L0 907 441 A
   Component: J772__Rearview      0050  
   Revision: --H12---    Serial number: 525PA8-J6820W9
   Coding: 1000204
   Shop #: WSC 02335 785 00200
   VCID: DDBBE63904FE43F65F5-8088

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 72: Door, Rear Right        Labels: 4F0-910-795.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 795 E    HW: 4F0 959 794 E
   Component: TSG HR          H21 0050  
   Coding: 0051754
   Shop #: WSC 02327 785 00200
   VCID: 2E59F1F5B9D8086E36F-807B

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist        Labels: 4Fx-910-283.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 283 F    HW: 4F0 919 283 F
   Component: Parkhilfe 4-Kan H09 0060  
   Revision: 00H09000    Serial number: 06230631100009
   Coding: 0021306
   Shop #: WSC 131071 1023 2097151
   VCID: 275704D196225926F59-8072

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 77: Telephone        Labels: 4E0-910-336.lbl
   Part No SW: 4F0 910 336 H    HW: 4E0 862 335 
   Component: Handyvorb2      H16 1130  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000007553465
   Coding: 0010900
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 285507ED9B3C565EFC3-807D

No fault code found.

End   ---------------------------------------------------------------------

Uwe · Mar 3, 2014

Have you tried going in via Address 31? In principle you should be able to see the same value from both ECUs at the same time, like this:

I had to think about it and look it up in the manual myself.

-Uwe-

dafrazi · Mar 4, 2014

Thanks. I'll give it a try.

Dana · Mar 6, 2014

If the MAF sensors are the same part number you could evaluate MVB 032 first and then swap the sensors (left to right banks). After some normal driving check to see if the fuel trims and/or fault code moves to the other bank.

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Fuel_Trim_Info

(I believe you need to check each controller in 032 but see what Address 31 does for you)

dafrazi · Mar 20, 2014

the bank 2 description in the code threw me....

Thanks Dana and Uwe. I think I figured it out. You can't log the MAFs simultaneoulsy and you can't view the Bank 1 and Bank 2 sensors together.
The MAFs report to different ECUs. Passenger side MAF (Bank 1) reports to the main ECU. The passenger side (Bank 1) O2 sensors report to the Main ECU. The driver side MAF (Bank 2) reports to the slave ECU. The driver side (Bank 2) O2 sensors report to the slave ECU. I was getting confused by the Bank 2 portion of the error code but I think I know what the problem is now.

What was throwing me before is that the driver side (Bank 2) O2 sensors were reporting good long term fuel trims...the lambda values were OK too when I logged those. These facts were causing my confusion. It wasn't until I looked at the wiring diagram that it dawned on me.

I believe that the Bank 1 and Bank 2 O2 sensors the Main ECU is referring to are the two pre-cat sensors on the passenger side. The long term fuel trims on the Bank 2 sensor is +22.2, which probably means that the O2 sensor is not working correctly. Now to figure out which sensor is the Bank 2 sensor; hopefully, it's sensor G108. Replacing the other one involves dropping the engine.

Does this sound right to you guys?

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 21, 2014

Bank 1 Passenger Right side!
Bank 2 Drivers Left side!

This would be more indicative of a false air or small leak/Faulty MAF.

If the sensor was bad it usually reports dead with an additional code for no response pointing to a specific sensor.
Since it only reports a DTC for the bank .......which indicates both sensors are seeing the same thing as LEAN.
Don't be in a rush to drop a thing. Test .......! Consider a bank swap test to see if the DTC moves to other BANK!

dafrazi · Mar 21, 2014

Jack@European_Parts said:
Bank 1 Passenger Right side!
Bank 2 Drivers Left side!

This would be more indicative of a false air or small leak/Faulty MAF.

If the sensor was bad it usually reports dead with an additional code for no response pointing to a specific sensor.
Since it only reports a DTC for the bank .......which indicates both sensors are seeing the same thing as LEAN.
Don't be in a rush to drop a thing. Test .......! Consider a bank swap test to see if the DTC moves to other BANK!

Let me make sure I have this straight because I'm confused again.

When I check block 32 in the Engine module I see these values: 1.0% 7.4% 1.9% 19.5%
When I check block 32 in the Engine II module I see these values: 1.6% 6.6% 1.4% 1.6%
So what are these values telling me? From your statement, I'm interpreting them wrong.

Also, I would love to do a bank swap but that involves dropping the engine to get to one of the O2 sensors on each side. If that's the case I will just replace them and not test them.

The engine has been smoke tested and no leaks were found...amazing right. I've checked the fuel pressures and there good too.
I've bank swapped the MAF sensors and nothing changed. I didn't think it would since both throttle bodies are connected to a small plenum on top of the manifold but I did it anyway to rule out the MAFs. Both MAFs could be on their way out but, would be pretty rare for them both to go at the same time.

FYI: I cleared the codes last night after I fixed two cracked wires on the throttle body connector; so, the 19.5% reading is still climbing. It usually levels out in the 22.3% range.

Uwe · Mar 21, 2014

I do agree that 19.5% (and climbing) is indicative of a problem. But if you've bank-swapped MAFs and that one high reading didn't move with the MAFs, then neither of the MAFs are likely to be the problem.

I find it interesting that each ECU reports data for two banks of oxygen sensors. That would make some sense on say, a W12, but not so much on a V10. How many oxygen sensors does this engine actually have? And the one that you suspect might be faulty: Is it possible to simply unplug that one (without removing it) just as a test?

-Uwe-

PS: Back to your original question: Did you ever try going onto Address 31 and looking at data there, as I suggested a few weeks ago? That really should work.

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 21, 2014

I am not referencing mixture values in blocks whatsoever......... based on what I am talking about.

Swaps for signals can be made at the junctions. So can a balance bank wire......as this verifies ecu interpretation and so can ecu's be swapped to isolate.

Since readiness is not achieved for SAI ( 077 )or evap ( 070 )/LDP ( 071 ) what is the story with those tests......?

Ever consider a vacuum lost on that bank due to stuck open leak? Make sure tank pumps up and is not sucked down like raisin. Verify N80 seals not just passes an 070....

I'm sure you are not smoke testing while running...... smoke doesn't always play well verse a vacuum pump...or vise grip test crimp to authenticate.

Break It down to basics first......

dafrazi · Mar 22, 2014

The car has 4 Cats and has 8-O2 sensors. Block 31 didn't seem to be showing both banks of the engine (both sides) but I can't be sure since I'm not getting any labels on the blocks. I'm not sure if VCDS isn't finding the write label file or even if there is a label for this car.

All readiness codes will set. I've been fixing a couple of things that popped up on this car while it was really cold here (stuck manifold flappers, intermittent throttle body problems); so, the readiness codes probably hadn't reset from clearing a code in the Engine Module when I posted the Autoscan.

The lean code always comes back within a drive cycle but doesn't trigger the MIL for about 2 weeks.

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 22, 2014

Yes okay so they pass readiness... VCDS does support all the data the OEM tester shows and more.
Watching block values for 031 is not part of the solution in my opinion as we already know we have a lean condition in the bank which is consistent by second DCY.

I am asking if you have tested the systems which directly related to vacuum such as the N80 or the run back to LDP for a small leak more comprehensive?

Smoke won't show slow leaks such as this or slightly stuck valves internally.
A mighty vac will when observing PSI drop or the ability to suck down and view a leak isolating each run with vacuum caps.
In addition brake booster itself and lines, auxiliary booster pump valves should be isolated if supported.

An example that the 070 test on the OEM side just using a scanner is a BS TEST : Take gas cap off and run it......it will pass. If N80 is stuck open it will also pass.

Experience tells me:
If issue is not above or what you have attempted.
It is most likely you have a slight intake leak which is at the respective bank.
It is leaking during expansion of heat and never will be detected by smoke!

dafrazi · Mar 22, 2014

I can't do those tests. I'll have to take in to someone who can. What is LDP?

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 22, 2014

Leak detection pump......

I believe you can do those tests.....

gregplatt · Mar 28, 2014

Dafrazi,
Hi i have the same car with the exact same problem. Currently my problem is that the bank 4 fuel trim is .5 and 21.5% respectively, and throwing a code for upper limit exceeded.
Some background, we had a cold start misfire issue, plus after a smoke test an obvious leak on the intake manifold plus a fuel trim issue. I had the intake re-sealed as well as de-carbonization at the same time. Car is running good right now but has the trim issue.
I have noticed that when I reset the fuel trims i have a misfire on cylinder 10, not horrible but it will register up to 60 or 70 misfires per cycle before it resets. Then as the fuel trim is adjusted out towards 21.5% the misfire will go away. I know that the bank 4 refers to cylinder's 9 and 10, so I feel that I have a bad or plugged injector on 10 which should account for both of these symptoms. I've swapped the MAF's from side to side with no difference, both were tested and showing a flow rate of .30 pounds per second (my machine uses pounds instead of grams) which should be ok. 02 sensors look fine. We also replaced the intake flap actuator motor, it had an issue.
Please chime in and tell me what you think before I dig into this engine again.

Just to be clear i'm a mechanic but first time with a 5.2L. I'm using VCDS plus other diag tools.
Thanks
Greg

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 28, 2014

Sounds like a leak present for that respective cylinder at intake.

dafrazi · Mar 31, 2014

I had the same problem with the number 5 & 10 cylinders and tried the same fixes...smoke testing, fuel pressure checking, MAF checking, new plugs, new coils, carbon cleaning, new injectors on #5 & #10, new intake manifold gaskets, new valve cover gaskets, compression testing, wire chasing, etc. I haven't seen a lean code for any bank other than 2. The car would misfire like crazy as the car came up to temp. I could stop and restart the car once it got hot and not have any issues. After each attempted fix, the problem would go away for a while but kept coming back. See below for what was causing the issue...this took a lot of trouble shooting to figure out...about 4 months and lots of angry looks from my wife to get it resolved. Every Audi specialist I talked to thought it was something with the ECU...who could blame them. The solution dawned on me when the weather warmed up and the issue went away only to return when we got a quick blast of cold weather.

What I had was the connectors for the #5 and #10 coils backing off their coils, just a little, as the car cooled down. When the car would heat up, the expansion would push them tight again. The root of my problem was the clips on the connectors being broken from the loom being connected and disconnected so many times. I think this misfire problem is why my car's previous owner got rid it and kindly didn't tell me about. What I did to resolve this after much hunting and various procedures was to loosen the two torx screws that holds the coils' wire loom in place, just a little, so that the wire loom could float during warm up and cool down. I used a little blue lock tight to keep the torx screws from backing out. I haven't had any misfire problems since figuring out that little trick.

Now, my only issue is the lean code. I bought an O2 sensor to swap out the precat O2 sensor you can actually get to and am going to make up a wire jumper for the other O2 sensor to try a fake bank swap like Jack recommended. I also got a mighty vac to check for vac leaks where Jack suggested just haven't had the time to do this yet.

Jack@European_Parts · Mar 31, 2014

Just keep in mind balance wires are for testing only of the ecu ability to interpret a reading.
A cross check DTC if implemented may be initiated as a result, however...... not always.

Just like you had an expansion of the coil connectors.......The same is most likely happening during the temp transition of a warped intake or faulty gasket.

I find that a plane of the intake slight, or adding a flexible sealer to account for the expansion, will solve the problem verse changing the intake.

If a laser temp gun is used at cold to operating temp........ you can verify for yourself the hot spot in this general area of the manifold is subjected to.

I have recommended to a few to add intake cooling fans with success and it did add some seat of the pants TQ as a result to help prevent.

'07 Audi S6 5.2L V10 MAF sensor logging

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