Testbench setup?

DV52 · Jul 20, 2017

Eric said:
I do need it! I'm merely interested in a permanent terminal 15 solution so other modules can power up and talk to VCDS.

Eric: Here you go_

I'm not sure if you "Yanks" get taught these diagrams the same as us Southerners, but I hope the table is self explanatory

I've shown the way the Key-switch connector locks into the body of the steering module in the lower LHS to indicate the relative position of pin#1

Lastly, I suspect that you probably know having hooked-up the steering module to your test-bench, but the PC board into which the key-switch connector fits is double-sided. So the Pins make contact on both sides of the board as shown in the lower LHS picture

Don

SI-R32 · Jul 20, 2017

I have a little set up like this for use on BT, RNS, gateway and window modules. i'm having a small issue that I can't get round hoping someone can help.

so with regard to the window wiring i'm mainly connecting gen 3 units so + power on 20 and 18, - on 19, can on 8 and 9, so I wanted to talk to a gen 2 unit the other day the only difference being pin 18 is now pin 12 for gen 2, but for the life of me it will not connect to the unit, elsa tell me can connections are the same going to convenience pins on the gateway. power all tested and all ok, one gen 2 unit is vw the other two are seat, so I even changed the vehicle manufacturer between vw and seat in the gateway but still won't talk to the modules.

any idea please.

thanks

Eric · Jul 20, 2017

DV52 said:
Eric: Here you go_

Victory! Your table matches perfectly the old MQB diagram we found after I came begging for your assistance:

however I hadn't bothered connecting pins T16r/7-14-16 to their mates on 09, because, who needs that, right?

Seriously, why can't 16 determine the switch status on its own!?
Anyway, now the measuring values show terminal 15 going to ON when I short 3-5-6. Thanks Don, you gave me the determination to look further than just the switch connection, once I knew we had it right :thumbs:

Bonus video produced and directed by Andy:

Andy · Jul 20, 2017

Bonus:

DV52 · Jul 20, 2017

Eric said:
Victory! Your table matches perfectly the old MQB diagram we found after I came begging for your assistance:

however I hadn't bothered connecting pins T16r/7-14-16 to their mates on 09, because, who needs that, right? Seriously, why can't 16 determine the switch status on its own!?
Anyway, now the measuring values show terminal 15 going to ON when I short 3-5-6. Thanks Don, you gave me the determination to look further than just the switch connection, once I knew we had it right
Bonus video produced and directed by Andy:

Eric: No offense, but that's the weirdest American accent I've ever heard!!!

Well done- it took me a long time to get to the stage that you're at with your test bench - but then, I didn't have Andy, or a nifty "Sperry" multi-meter as aids!!!

Just a minor point about "connecting pin3 to pin 5 and pin 6" (as your say in the video), my experience has been that some of the modules in my test bench (i.e. the BCM occasionally, but more frequently, the instrument module - and others) get cranky if the steering module doesn't also see pin 4 connected. Makes sense (IMO) - because in a real car the "S" contact is closed before, and during the period of ignition-on and engine-on (because of the act of inserting the key shaft into the key-switch). Something to consider!

Don

ibis_white · Jul 20, 2017

I've looked at the current flow diagram for a 2014 e-Golf and in the fitting location section/ connector view and there are two pins labelled as Terminal 15. These are 16 and 14. Below shows how they connect to the J519 module :

Module J519 T73a/47 goes to module J527 T16r/16 which appears in the cruise control section.
Module J519 T73a/44 goes to module J527 T16r/14 which appears in the turn signal switch, horn plate and airbag section.

Not sure if this is any use???

DV52 · Sep 6, 2017

OBD is wierd!!

So, more questions about stuff that I probably should know - but don't

When I wired-up the OBD port on my test bench I connected the CAN and power supply pins thinking that that's all that was needed. I'm now contemplating adding an airbag module (for no other reason than I can get one gratis). However, a quick glance at the WD has me puzzled:

Yes, pin #15 on the OBD port apparently does stuff on a mk7- go figure!!

If I look at the standard pin-out on and OBD port, I find:

So- question: Does the VCDS dongle read (write?) from the L-line pin?

Don

Uwe · Sep 6, 2017

Yes. ISO specified pin 15 as the L-line, but that use has been deprecated for roughly 20 years now and VW/Audi used it as a second K-line for a while (~2001-2008) when they had some cars (primarily Audi A4 and A6) that had too much stuff to hang on one K-line.

I'm somewhat surprised to see this in an Mk.7...

However, there was also a Polo back in 2008 that gave us fits due to a mystery wire to pin 15...

-Uwe-

DV52 · Sep 6, 2017

Uwe: thanks (also thanks for not making me feel so foolish in asking the question) - so does a HEX-NET actually connect to this pin? And what was L-line used for in the earlier models (resetting the airbag module -perhaps)?

Don

Uwe · Sep 6, 2017

Yes, a HEX-NET will connect to a K-line module on pin 15.

Of course, whether an Mk.7 Airbag module actually responds in the way that older K-line modules did is another question. This connection might be intended for some (even more) proprietary tool to read out crash data when the all the CAN stuff in the car is toast due to a crash? I'm not sure.

On really old cars, the L-line was a unidirectional signal from the scan tool to the car on which the normal 5 bps initialization sequence was duplicated. I suppose it went to a separate UART in the some control modules that did nothing but listen for init sequences?

-Uwe-

Sebastian · Sep 7, 2017

Bosch's CDR Tool, is one of those proprietary ways which this may be intended for.

http://www.crashdatagroup.com

DV52 · Sep 7, 2017

^^^ Sebastian: brilliant!!! But I'm not sure that I can justify $3,650 for the basic kit! At least I am beginning to understand why pin #15 might be connected to the OBD (DLC?) port. Thanks again for the input

Don

Uwe · Sep 7, 2017

DV52 said:
^^^ Sebastian: brilliant!!! But I'm not sure that I can justify $3,650 for the basic kit!

For an insurance company or a police investigative unit, that's not a big expenditure.

-Uwe-

iichel · Sep 8, 2017

ah cool, a testbench topic.

my setup is based on my experience in software and simulation, to get as close to the 'real deal' as possible. i've taken a wiring loom of a Beetle and stripped it to its bare essentials. then somehow screwed it into a wooden frame and tadaaa...

can Gateway can either be an external PQ25 (6R0), PQ35 (7N0) or internal in the BCM. ignition is done with the the buttons at the bottom.
lighting is not present, since sometimes the PQ25 does the light over the light switch rather than the BCM.

power is supplied by a car battery and a pair of jump start cables... lol

DV52 · Sep 8, 2017

^^^^^^^^^ ooooooooooohh - very nice!!!!!! Can I see more of what's in the cardboard box?

iichel · Sep 8, 2017

haha that's what's leftover of the beetle wiring loom

Sebastian · Sep 9, 2017

Yet another more simplistic and reduced to the bare minimum approach...

...plug in any number of modules you want, the DB25 connectors are standardized one can extend the setup by adding more multiplexers (if 5 connectors/modules aren't enough).

BTW: This is based on the same concept, posted a while back earlier in this topic.

DV52 · Sep 9, 2017

Sebastian: I have to bow respectfully at your feet - I have never seen a more sublimely clean solution :thanks:

Alas I'm more at iichel's level = spaghetti wires, random chaos connectors and an unswerving religious faith in the God-of-chance is what keeps my rig working (or not as is usually the case)!

Don

Sebastian · Sep 9, 2017

Don't bow before me, André who works for one of our distribs makes these happen - my only part in this was helping specify requirements way back when as well as occasionally helping what additional signals/inputs/outputs etc. may or may not be required...

iichel · Sep 9, 2017

DV52 said:
rig working (or not as is usually the case)!

guy's gotta have some fun, right?

I deeply respect the cleanness of sebastians rig as well though... wow. just wow.

Testbench setup?

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