Laggy response when releasing throttle 2.0T CCZ engine

   #1  

minke

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Hi,

I'm happy to post my question here (or have it moved):

I've just bought a cable to help me workout what is going on with my car. Three dealers are using the 'it's normal' canned response but when I compare to my friends same make and model, it isn't behaving the same way.

The Car:
10/2012 VW Golf GTI Mark 6 - Manual and leather are the only options
40,000km - I believe it has been doing this for the last 10,000 or so.

Behavioural issue:

Driving along cruising with rpm around 2500 and light throttle application. Once I remove the throttle the car continues to maintain current speed for approximately two seconds before engine braking occurs. This is evident by:
(a) the engine note doesn't change after lifting off the throttle. It only changes after two seconds
(b) the recommend gear that is displayed in the top right hand corner of the central DIN is still telling me to upshift. Once engine braking is occuring the suggested gear then changes to indicate the current gear that you're in.
(c) you cannot feel the car slowing down for the first two seconds of being off the throttle
(d) whilst engine compression braking (actual) a slight touch of the throttle (a mere blip) equals the car to do the whole maintain current rpm for two second before compression braking again
(e) as a test I was driving along and pulled the car out of gear (no clutch) and lifted off the throttle and sure enough (as you can see in the you tube video) the rpm holds high for around two seconds before dropping back down to idle.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri5GUdv1LtA

I've completed an initial scan - the results are below:

I've also spent a few minute monitoring lambda. What was noted is the sensor was reading 0.9ish while on light throttle. As soon as I lifted off the throttle the value changed to around 1.02 for the two seconds after lifting off throttle before changing to 1.999 once engine compression braking started occurring. I read that as the car is still fuelling even though I am off the throttle

My question is -
How do I use VAG-COM to capture the data I need to show what is going on isn't normal
Or can I clear out all the 'learning' the car has done and return it as if it is factory fresh


Code:
Tuesday,13,October,2015,09:08:57:06238
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 15.7.1.0 (x64)
Data version: 20150904
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: WVWZZZ1KZDWxxxxxx   License Plate: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 1K (7N0)
Scan: 01 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 25 2E 42 44 46 52 56 62 72 77

VIN: WVWZZZ1KZDWxxxxxx   Mileage: 40360km-25078miles

01-Engine -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: Malfunction 0010
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: OK 0000
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
2E-Media Player 3 -- Status: OK 0000
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: OK 0000
44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: OK 0000
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
77-Telephone -- Status: OK 0000
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine (CCZ)       Labels: 06J-907-115-CCZ.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 907 115 N    HW: 1K0 907 115 AA
   Component: 2.0l R4/4V TFSI     0010  
   Revision: AAH18---    Serial number:               
   Coding: 0403000C18070160
   Shop #: WSC 10442 002 1048576
   VCID: 354FD7135C592896BE-8060

No fault code found.
Readiness: 0000 0000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes (J104)       Labels: 1K0-907-379-60EC1F.clb
   Part No SW: 1K0 907 379 BL    HW: 1K0 907 379 BL
   Component: ESP MK60EC1   H31 0152  
   Revision: 00H31001    
   Coding: 163B600D092380FC680D06E590190181350800
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 7DDF0F33E4E930D636-8028

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC (J255)       Labels: 5K0-907-044.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 907 044 GK    HW: 5K0 907 044 GK
   Component: Climatronic   H19 1313  
   Revision: 00001004    
   Coding: 0010002002
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Climatronic A01010
   ROD: EV_ClimaAutoBasis_VW36.rod
   VCID: 7AD5042FFDC707EE13-802E

1 Fault Found:
9472881 - Motor for Fresh Air / Recirculated Air Flap 
          B108B 71 [008] - Actuator stuck
          Intermittent - Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00000001
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 29
                    Mileage: 40284 km
                    Date: 2015.10.11
                    Time: 07:48:46


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. (J519)       Labels: 1K0-937-08x-09.clb
   Part No SW: 1K0 937 086 R    HW: 1K0 937 086 R
   Component: BCM PQ35  M   111 0709  
   Revision: AC111709    
   Coding: 48180A3A8025F1C0408800C0340001644B510288536D8D60648000200040
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 3FA3B53BAE65E2C664-806A

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 5K2 955 119 
   Component: Wischer 03101  26  0512 
   Coding: 009795

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 1K0 955 559 AH  Labels: 1K0-955-559-AG.CLB
   Component: RLS 291012 05  54  0403 
   Coding: 0230AD

   Subsystem 3 - Part No: 1K8 951 171 
   Component: DWA-Sensor 00  001 0104 

   Subsystem 4 - Part No: 1K0 951 605 C
   Component: LIN BACKUP HO  H05 1501 

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags (J234)       Labels: 5K0-959-655.clb
   Part No SW: 5C0 959 655 B    HW: 5C0 959 655 B
   Component: AirbagVW10    013 0613  
   Serial number: 003G5RAPPA7%  
   Coding: 00003956
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_AirbaVW10SMEVW360 A01014
   ROD: EV_AirbaVW10SMEVW360_SE36.rod
   VCID: 3147E303603104B6E2-8064

   Crash sensor for side airbag; driver side: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 5K0 959 354     HW: 5K0 959 354 
   Component: S.Sens.Fahr.V  H02 ---- 
   Serial number: 3572MSME76617571ZZZX

   Crash sensor for side airbag; front passenger side: 
   Subsystem 2 - Part No SW: 5K0 959 354     HW: 5K0 959 354 
   Component: S.Sens.Beif.V  H02 ---- 
   Serial number: 3582MSME12627571ZZZP

   Crash sensor for side airbag; rear; driver side: 
   Component: S.Sens.Fahr.H  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 3512QSME42112000ZZZ1

   Crash sensor for side airbag; rear; passenger side: 
   Component: S.Sens.Beif.H  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 3522QSME5A03215DZZZV

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel (J527)       Labels: 5K0-953-569.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 953 507 BC    HW: 5K0 953 549 E
   Component: Lenks.Modul   008 0080  
   Revision: --------    Serial number:  90440LJL0006I
   Coding: 1082140000
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_SMLSNGKUDS A05001
   ROD: EV_SMLSNGKUDS_SE36.rod
   VCID: 72C52C0FA5B77FAE5B-8026

   Multi Function Steering Wheel Control Module: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 5K0 959 542 C    HW: 5K0 959 542 C  Labels: 3C8-959-537.CLB
   Component: E221__MFL-TAS  H31 0033 
   Serial number: 0313067             
   Coding: 820000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments (J285)       Labels: 5K0-920-xxx-17.clb
   Part No SW: 5K6 920 873     HW: 5K6 920 873 
   Component: KOMBI         H05 0705  
   Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 170B01
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09 A04716
   ROD: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09_SK35.rod
   VCID: 73CB290BDAAD76A650-8026

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway (J533)       Labels: 7N0-907-530-V2.clb
   Part No SW: 7N0 907 530 AF    HW: 7N0 907 530 AF
   Component: J533  Gateway H52 1634  
   Revision:   H52       Serial number: 131012F1000426
   Coding: 350003
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 74C92A17D7A3719E49-8020

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 25: Immobilizer (J334)       Labels: 5K0-920-xxx-25.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 953 234     HW: 5K0 953 234 
   Component: IMMO          H05 0705  
   Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 000000
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Immo_UDS_VDD_RM09 A03709
   ROD: EV_Immo_UDS_VDD_RM09_SE25.rod
   VCID: 6AF5346F8D67B76EE3-803E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 2E: Media Player 3 (J650)       Labels: 5N0-035-342.lbl
   Part No SW: 5N0 035 342 F    HW: 5N0 035 342 F
   Component: SG EXT.PLAYER H18 0546  
   Revision: A1001003    Serial number: 7663694328    
   Coding: 010100
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 2A75F46F45E7776E23-807E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 42: Door Elect, Driver        Labels: 1K0-959-701-MIN3.lbl
   Part No SW: 5K0 959 701 B    HW: 5K0 959 701 B
   Component: Tuer-SG         009 2120  
   Coding: 0000692
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 3147E303A83104B6E2-8064

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 1Kx-909-14x-44.clb
   Part No: 1K0 909 144 P
   Component: EPS_ZFLS Kl. 74     3305  
   Revision: 00H22000    
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 3753DD1B4655DA86AC-8062

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 52: Door Elect, Pass.        Labels: 1K0-959-702-MIN3.lbl
   Part No SW: 5K0 959 702 B    HW: 5K0 959 702 B
   Component: Tuer-SG         009 2120  
   Coding: 0000692
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 3245EC0FAD373FAE9B-8066

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio (J0503)       Labels: 5M0-035-1xx-56.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 035 190 B    HW: 5K0 035 190 B
   Component: Radio RCD510  005 0236  
   Revision: 00000001    Serial number: VWZ1Z3M9856686
   Coding: 01000400040005
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   VCID: 24691A5727C3A11E19-8070

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 62: Door, Rear Left        Labels: 1K0-959-703-GEN3.lbl
   Part No SW: 5K0 959 703 D    HW: 5K0 959 703 D
   Component: Tuer-SG         007 2101  
   Coding: 0000144
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 1012552
   VCID: 354FD7135C592896BE-8060

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 72: Door, Rear Right        Labels: 1K0-959-704-GEN3.lbl
   Part No SW: 5K0 959 704 D    HW: 5K0 959 704 D
   Component: Tuer-SG         007 2101  
   Coding: 0000144
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 1012552
   VCID: 364DD01F415F238EB7-8062

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 77: Telephone (J412)       Labels: 7P6-035-730.clb
   Part No SW: 7P6 035 730 J    HW: 7P6 035 730 J
   Component: TELEFON       H15 3200  
   Revision: 1B001001    Serial number: 00007663707362
   Coding: 0A01000000010101
   Shop #: WSC 01357 011 00200
   ASAM Dataset: EV_UHVNA 002720
   ROD: EV_UHVNA.rod
   VCID: 3957DB23B841CCF65A-806C

No fault code found.

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 01:51)--------------------------
 
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   #2  

Uwe

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   #3  

minke

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Measuring Block Group 062 might be interesting. It will show you both pedal position sensors and both throttle position sensors.

As for getting verified, please see this post:
http://forums.ross-tech.com/showthread.php?2601-How-to-get-Verified
I suspect the the paragraph labelled 2) applies in this case.

-Uwe-

Yes - Re-seller in Australia. Ok I'll sort that out.

With regards to measuring block group 062 - would there be anything else worth logging at the same time?
 
   #4  

Uwe

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With regards to measuring block group 062 - would there be anything else worth logging at the same time?
Primarily RPM.

-Uwe-

PS: I'm going to change the title of this thread to something more descriptive...
 
   #5  

minke

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Uwe - Thank you.

What I've monitored thus far is throttle position (Group 62) and watched Sensor 2 (G185) which shows a value of 7.4% when I am not touching the pedal. While driving I can see that as soon as I lift off the throttle, that value instantly returns to 7.4%

I've also monitored group 31 in partucluar Lambda control Bank 1 (actual)

What I've noticed is that Lambda control bank 1 (actual) shows a value of 1.99 when actual compression braking occurs. I assume it relates to the percentage of oxygen in the exhaust. IE no fuel being delivered, so increase in oxygen going pass the lambda.

So in monitoring this I can see that there is a delay in closing the thotttle . And there is.



Code:
Thursday,15,October,2015,18:39:36:06238-VCID:354FD7135C592896BE-8060,VCDS Version: Release 15.7.1 (x64),Data version: 20150904,,,,,,,,,
5K0 907 115 N,,2.0l R4/4V TFSI     0010,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,Group A:,'062,,,,Group B:,'034,,,,Group C:,'031,,,
,,Throttle Valve,Throttle Valve,Accel. Pedal Pos.,Accel. Pedal Pos.,,Engine Speed,Catalytic Converter,Dynamic Factor,Result,,Lambda Control,Lambda Control, , 
,TIME,Sensor 1 (G187),Sensor 2 (G188),Sensor 1 (G79),Sensor 2 (G185),TIME,(G28),Bank 1 Temp.,Bank 1 Sensor 1,Lambda Aging,TIME,Bank 1 (actual),Bank 1 (specified),,
Marker,STAMP, %, %, %, %,STAMP, /min,°C,,,STAMP,,,,
,124.56,16.4,83.2,28.9,14.5,124.26,2320,594,1,Test OFF,124.42,0.9,1, ,
,124.99,16,83.6,28.9,14.5,124.7,2280,594,1,Test OFF,124.84,0.98,1, ,
,125.42,14.8,84.8,24.6,12.1,125.13,2280,588,1,Test OFF,125.27,0.99,1, ,
CLOSED,125.87,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,125.59,2240,588,1,Test OFF,125.73,0.98,1, ,
,126.31,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,126.01,2240,588,1,Test OFF,126.17,0.95,1, ,
,126.74,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,126.45,2200,588,1,Test OFF,126.59,1,1, ,
,127.18,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,126.88,2160,588,1,Test OFF,127.03,1,1, ,
,127.62,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,127.34,2120,588,1,Test ON,127.48,1.01,0.98, ,
,128.08,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,127.77,2120,588,1,Test OFF,127.93,1.05,0.95, ,
,128.52,14.5,85.2,14.8,7.4,128.22,2080,588,1,Test OFF,128.36,1.99,0.95, ,
,128.94,14.5,84.8,14.8,7.4,128.66,2080,582,1,Test OFF,128.8,1.99,0.95, ,
,129.38,14.5,85.2,14.8,7.4,129.1,2000,570,1,Test OFF,129.24,1.99,0.95, ,
,129.84,14.5,85.2,14.8,7.4,129.52,2000,564,1,Test OFF,129.7,1.99,0.95, ,
,130.28,14.1,85.5,14.8,7.4,129.98,1960,558,1,Test OFF,130.12,1.99,0.95, ,
,130.7,14.1,85.5,14.8,7.4,130.42,1920,546,1,Test OFF,130.56,1.99,0.95, ,
,131.13,14.1,85.5,14.8,7.4,130.86,1880,540,1,Test OFF,130.99,1.99,0.95, ,
,131.58,14.1,85.5,14.8,7.4,131.27,1840,534,1,Test OFF,131.44,1.99,0.95, ,
,132.02,14.1,85.9,14.8,7.4,131.72,1800,528,1,Test OFF,131.86,1.99,0.95, ,
,132.44,13.7,85.9,14.8,7.4,132.16,1760,522,1,Test OFF,132.3,1.99,0.95, ,
,132.88,13.7,86.3,14.8,7.4,132.6,1680,516,1,Test OFF,132.74,1.99,0.95, ,
,133.32,13.3,86.3,14.8,7.4,133.02,1640,510,1,Test OFF,133.18,1.99,0.95, ,
,133.76,13.3,86.3,14.8,7.4,133.46,1560,498,1,Test OFF,133.6,1.99,0.95, ,
,134.18,12.9,86.7,14.8,7.4,133.9,1480,492,1,Test OFF,134.04,1.99,0.95, ,
,134.62,12.5,87.1,14.8,7.4,134.33,1360,486,1,Test OFF,134.47,1.99,0.95, ,
,135.07,12.5,87.1,14.8,7.4,134.77,1240,480,1,Test OFF,134.93,1.99,0.95, ,
,135.51,12.1,87.5,14.8,7.4,135.21,1160,468,1,Test OFF,135.35,1.99,0.95, ,
,135.93,12.1,87.5,14.8,7.4,135.65,1040,468,1,Test OFF,135.79,1.99,0.95, ,
,136.38,12.1,87.5,14.8,7.4,136.09,960,462,1,Test OFF,136.24,1.99,0.9, ,
,136.82,12.5,86.7,20.3,10.2,136.52,960,468,1,Test OFF,136.68,1.75,0.9, ,
,137.26,13.3,86.3,25,12.5,136.96,1000,474,1,Test OFF,137.1,0.99,0.9, ,


There are occasions where the car does behave itself. I am yet to capture that in the data.
 
Last edited:
   #6  

minke

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Here is an example of releasing the throttle and response is instant.


Code:
Thursday,15,October,2015,19:06:37:06238-VCID:354FD7135C592896BE-8060,VCDS Version: Release 15.7.1 (x64),Data version: 20150904,,,,,,,,,
5K0 907 115 N,,2.0l R4/4V TFSI     0010,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,Group A:,'062,,,,Group B:,'034,,,,Group C:,'031,,,
,,Throttle Valve,Throttle Valve,Accel. Pedal Pos.,Accel. Pedal Pos.,,Engine Speed,Catalytic Converter,Dynamic Factor,Result,,Lambda Control,Lambda Control, , 
,TIME,Sensor 1 (G187),Sensor 2 (G188),Sensor 1 (G79),Sensor 2 (G185),TIME,(G28),Bank 1 Temp.,Bank 1 Sensor 1,Lambda Aging,TIME,Bank 1 (actual),Bank 1 (specified),,
Marker,STAMP, %, %, %, %,STAMP, /min,°C,,,STAMP,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,45.07,14.8,84.4,25.8,12.9,44.79,2360,546,1.03,B1-S1 OK,44.93,0.89,0.9, , 
,45.51,15.2,84.4,21.5,10.9,45.21,2320,546,1.03,B1-S1 OK,45.37,0.88,0.9, , 
,45.95,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,45.65,2360,546,1.03,B1-S1 OK,45.79,0.89,0.9, , 
3,46.38,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,46.1,2320,546,1.03,B1-S1 OK,46.24,0.99,0.95, , 
,46.82,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,46.54,2360,552,1.03,B1-S1 OK,46.68,1.99,0.95, , 
,47.26,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,46.96,2360,546,1.03,B1-S1 OK,47.12,1.99,0.95, , 
,47.7,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,47.4,2360,540,1.03,B1-S1 OK,47.54,1.99,0.95, , 
,48.13,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,47.85,2360,528,1.03,B1-S1 OK,47.99,1.99,0.95, , 
,48.57,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,48.29,2360,522,1.03,B1-S1 OK,48.43,1.99,0.95, , 
,49.01,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,48.71,2360,510,1.03,B1-S1 OK,48.87,1.99,0.95, ,
 
   #7  

minke

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I'm sorry for the three posts in a row but wanted to separate out what I can see.

The above two posts have logs from separate runs/logging. I am assuming the time stamp is in seconds.

When there is laggy response in closing the throttle
The time stamp from when I close the throttle is: 125.78
The time stamp from when lambda sensor registers 1.99 is: 128.36

2.5 second delay

When there isn't a lag closing the throttle
Time stamp when throttle is closed : 45.95
Time stamp when lambda is 1.99 : 46.86

less than a one second delay.

So - The car is still under warranty. It's been to several dealers all saying it is fine. How do I convince them that it isn't, and what should they look for.
 
   #8  

Uwe

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Yeah, I see the throttle valve following the throttle pedal fairly well, but the lambda not, but I don't have an immediate theory why.

-Uwe-
 
   #9  

minke

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Yeah, I see the throttle valve following the throttle pedal fairly well, but the lambda not, but I don't have an immediate theory why.

-Uwe-

Thank you. Let me know if you want me to monitor any other groups and go for a drive....
 
   #10  

minke

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Uwe - have you had any thoughts on what this could possibly be? Should I do any other logging of any particular groups? Injectors? fuel pump?

Not sure if it is related - but I also feel that shifting between gears (it is a manual gearbox) that revs can often hang as well. A few occasions when in neutral and at an intersection I'll blip the throttle and the revs will climb to around 2000rpm - hang for a while (not as long) before coming back down.

Finally - I'm finding the oil temp (as my centre console shows it) is anywhere from 109c to 123c (as I saw on the weekend during a long drive)

THank you for taking the time to help me.
 
   #11  

Uwe

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   #12  

Zenerdiode

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can I clear out all the 'learning' the car has done and return it as if it is factory fresh

Even though there aren't any, try clearing faults from the 01-ECU.
 
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AIB Wolfgang

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Hello
Tricky situation!
I would look for
Load Status,,Range: Idle/Partial Throttle/Wide Open Throttle (WOT)/Enrichment/Deceleration !
Throttle Valve Angle,,Range: 0.0...100.0 % and the conditions for basic settings as Throttle Valve closed and Idle Switch closed while lift the throttle pedal
 
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   #14  

minke

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Thanks for the ideas. Not being a guru with this application yet, I'm struggling to find which M Block value to monitor idle switch?

Also - what M-Block would show the application of the brake pedal? The reason is I want to be able to demonstrate that the car still have laggy throttle when I'm applying the brakes. This would be a safety issue as the car is propelling itself while I'm off the throttle and on the brakes.

cheers
 
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minke

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I've had a different thoughts. I need the manufacturer to take me seriously on this. The one way I think I can do that is show them that the car is 'supplying fuel' to the engine after I have lifted off the throttle and that I am now on the brake. That why I can go to VW and say "The car is propelling itself even though I'm on the brake. This is a safety issue"

So I think I need to capture the following data:
Lambda (prove fuel is being consumed)
Throttle pedal sensor (prove it is closed)
Throttle valve (prove it is closed)
fuel injectors (prove it is supplying fuel)
brake sensor (that I'm actively pressing the brakes)

Does that make sense? if so how do I achieve that using VCDS. What m BLocks best to capture etc..

Thank you for any and all help.

ps I reset the 01-ECU - no change
 
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Uwe

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Pedal and throttle position sensors and lambda, you already know how/where to log.

Brake: Look in MVB 008.1 or at the bits in MVB 066.

Injector pulse length: MVB 002.

-Uwe-
 
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minke

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Thanks Uwe. I wasn't able to get 008.1 (not accepted when entering that value in the M Blocks field. However I did measure the following
002 Injector
062 Throttle pedal position and valve
066 brake pedal

From what I can see below this is what I read:
At time stamp 37.74 the throttle pedal is closed, the brakes are off and the injectors are pulsing 0.77ms
at time stamp 38.33 the throttle is still closed. The brakes have been applied. The injectors are still pulsing at 0.77ms
at time stamp 40.22 the throttle is still closed. THe brakes are still on. The injectors finally stop deliverying fuel.

I read that as for 2.5 seconds after throttle closed - injectors are still supplying fuel regardless if the brakes are applied or not.

The reason I wanted to do this test and get this data was the dealer said that it was 'torque vectoring' and that is normal behaviour. I don't think any manufacturer would want their car to continue providing fuel to the engine while the driver is on the brake. It would mean longer stopping distance and thus a safety concern.

Where to from here? I'd really like to know if there is a way to wipe all the adaptive learned the car has done over the last 40,000km. ? In the hope that it would help.


Code:
Friday,30,October,2015,11:20:12:06238-VCID:354FD7135C592896BE-8060,VCDS Version: Release 15.7.1 (x64),Data version: 20150904,,,,,,,,,
5K0 907 115 N,,2.0l R4/4V TFSI     0010,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
,Group A:,'062,,,,Group B:,'066,,,,Group C:,'002,,,
,,Throttle Valve,Throttle Valve,Accel. Pedal Pos.,Accel. Pedal Pos.,,Vehicle Speed,Switch Positions I,Vehicle Speed,Switch Positions II,,Engine Speed,Engine Load,Injection Timing,Mass Air Flow
,TIME,Sensor 1 (G187),Sensor 2 (G188),Sensor 1 (G79),Sensor 2 (G185),TIME,(current),,(specified),,TIME,(G28),,,Sensor (G70)
Marker,STAMP, %, %, %, %,STAMP, km/h,, km/h,,STAMP, /min, %, ms, g/s
,36.42,16.4,83.2,28.9,14.5,36.58,56,1000,0,0,36.72,2760,19.5,1.02,10.86
,36.86,16,83.2,28.9,14.5,37,56,1000,0,0,37.16,2760,18,1.02,9.97
1,37.3,16,83.6,28.9,14.5,37.44,56,1000,0,0,37.58,2720,17.3,1.02,9.14
,37.74,15.6,84,14.8,7.4,37.89,55,1000,0,0,38.03,2720,15.8,0.77,9.36
,38.17,15.6,84,14.8,7.4,38.33,55,1011,0,0,38.47,2680,15.8,0.77,9.44
,38.61,15.6,84,14.8,7.4,38.75,53,1011,0,0,38.91,2560,15.8,0.77,8.92
,39.05,15.6,84,14.8,7.4,39.19,51,1011,0,0,39.33,2480,15.8,0.77,8.53
,39.49,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,39.64,49,1011,0,0,39.78,2400,15.8,0.77,8.36
,39.92,15.2,84.4,14.8,7.4,40.08,48,1011,0,0,40.22,2280,15.8,0,7.75
,40.36,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,40.5,46,1011,0,0,40.66,2200,15.8,0,7.47
2,40.81,14.8,84.8,14.8,7.4,40.95,44,1011,0,0,41.09,2080,15,0,7.06
,41.25,14.5,85.2,14.8,7.4,41.39,42,1000,0,0,41.53,2040,15,0,6.78
,41.67,14.5,84.8,30.1,15.2,41.83,41,1000,0,0,41.97,2040,26.3,1.53,12.61
,42.11,21.9,77.7,46.1,23,42.25,41,1000,0,0,42.41,2080,68.4,2.81,33.56
 
   #18  

minke

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Hi - Thought I'd post a message.

My car is off to the dealer service department on Thursday. Any suggests? I have provided the information and plan to take a tech for a drive with the laptop/VCDS and show them the injectors fueling whilst the throttle is closed.

One question - are the register numbers the same for the factory computers monitor? ie if I talk about 62, 66, 02 they'll (or they should?) know what I'm referring to?

I am just wanting to minimise the risk of "Oh that VCDS isn't accurate. or that VCDS is compeltely wrong' Not saying it is - just want to be prepared for the "this is too hard, lets blame something else"
 
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Uwe

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Yes, they can look at the same data in the same group numbers -- assuming of course that they are not complete n00bs who only know how to do "guided" stuff with their tools.

-Uwe-
 
   #20  

minke

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Yes, they can look at the same data in the same group numbers -- assuming of course that they are not complete n00bs who only know how to do "guided" stuff with their tools.

-Uwe-

Thanks

The tech didn't know the group numbers but knew the G references. They agree that it isn't right but their only solution is to start swapping out parts (ECU, sensors etc...) to chase it down.
 
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