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Thread: Cluster swap encrypted 93c86 clocks question

  1. #1
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    Cluster swap encrypted 93c86 clocks question

    Hello Ross-Tech forum,


    New member here from the UK with a weird question, here goes!

    I've been helping a friend who needs their instrument cluster swapped (km/h clocks to mp/h uk clocks) The car in question is a VW Polo GTi 9n3 1.8t 2007 model which I believe is immo 3, VDO clocks with a micronas cpu fitted and 93c86 eeprom.

    I found a used set of clocks for him, corrected the mileage, changed immo ID, VIN and SKC to match the info I extracted from his original engine ECU. I then posted him the clocks and later found that the immobiliser kicked in. Strange as I thought I had matched the SKC's etc etc etc.

    The first step of the new cluster install is to fit the replacement new or used clocks, and then click 'login' and using the SKC of the new clocks - this didn't work/wasn't accepted and because of this channel 50 showed error.

    My main question is - since the SKC in the replacement clocks is the same as the one in the original ecu and also the existing km/h clocks... could this be the issue? will vcds not accept the initial login code if the code matches that of the existing setup?

    I'd appreciate any help you can give! Please let me know if anything I've written doesn't make sense or i need to clear anything up.

  2. #2
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    Please post an Auto-Scan for context.

    Advanced ID (if available) from 01, 17, and 25 couldn't hurt either.

    -Uwe-
    Lock-down of sick people: Quarantine
    Lock-down of healthy people: Tyranny

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uwe View Post
    Please post an Auto-Scan for context.

    Advanced ID (if available) from 01, 17, and 25 couldn't hurt either.

    -Uwe-
    Thanks for the reply Uwe!

    I got my friend to run an autoscan and have attached the result. Tried to get the advanced ID's but for the control modules you requested each button was greyed out!

    NOTE: This is with original ECU and original cluster fitted.

    Code:
    Wednesday,08,April,2020,17:51:26:44672
    VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 7 x86
    VCDS Version: 18.2.0.3
    Data version: 20180212 DS287.0
    www.Ross-Tech.com
    
    
    VIN: WVWZZZ9NZ6Y117915   License Plate: OGZ5415
    Mileage: 68480km-42551mi   Repair Order: 
    
    
    
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    
    Chassis Type: 9N (9N - VW Polo (2002 > 2010))
    Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 17 19 25 37 44 45 46 56 76
     
    VIN: WVWZZZ9NZ6Y117915   Mileage: 68480km-42551miles
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 01: Engine        Labels: None
       Part No: 06A 906 032 TL
       Component: 1.8l R4/5VT         0040  
       Coding: 11500
       Shop #: WSC 33278  
       VCID: 7BFEEA84694BE09C4D-50C8
       WVWZZZ9NZ6Y117915     VWZ7Z0E2700479
    
    No fault code found.
    Readiness: 0000 0000
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 6R0-907-37x-ESP80.clb
       Part No SW: 6Q0 907 379 AE    HW: 6Q0 907 379 AE
       Component: ESP 8.0 front   H02 0001  
       Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000000000000
       Coding: 0000269
       Shop #: WSC 00788 785 00200
       VCID: 00049D6850AD834418-50AC
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: 6Q0-820-045.lbl
       Part No: 6Q0 820 045 
       Component: Klimaanlage        X0840  
       VCID: 6AD0DFC016D16914A6-50C8
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels:. 6Qx-937-049-C.lbl
       Part No: 6Q1 937 049 D
       Component: 00AF BN-SG.         1S34  
       Coding: 25758
       Shop #: WSC 00788  
       VCID: 3C7C29982CC527A404-50AC
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
       Part No: 1C0 909 605 F
       Component: 29 AIRBAG VW61 0P07 0003  
       Coding: 12857
       Shop #: WSC 00788  
       VCID: 2756E6F4C543947C79-50C8
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 6Q0-920-xxx-17.lbl
       Part No: 6Q0 920 803 PX
       Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V02  
       Coding: 02544
       Shop #: WSC 73410  
       VCID: 152ADC3C6F2F16ECDB-50AC
       WVWZZZ9NZ6Y117915     VWZ7Z0E2700479
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
       Part No: 6N0 909 901 
       Component: 0B7L GATEWAY CAN    1S34  
       Coding: 00014
       Shop #: WSC 00788  
       VCID: 70E4CDA8300D93C4E8-50AC
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 6Q0-423-156.clb
       Part No: 6Q0 423 156 AB
       Component: LenkhilfeTRW        V270  
       Coding: 10120
       Shop #: WSC 00788  
       VCID: 6FE6CED42D338C3CF1-50C8
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels:. 6Q0-959-433.clb
       Part No: 6Q0 959 433 F
       Component: 3Q KomfortgerŠt     0002  
       Coding: 00019
       Shop #: WSC 00788  
       VCID: 3E7823903AD935B42A-4A82
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 56: Radio        Labels: 1K0-035-1xx-56.lbl
       Part No SW: 6Q0 035 152 A    HW: 6Q0 035 152 A
       Component: Radio BVX       005 0004  
       Revision: 00005000    Serial number: VWZ1Z5F9016371
       Coding: 0040400
       Shop #: WSC 00788 785 00200
       VCID: 2854E5C8985D9B0470-50AC
    
    1 Fault Found:
    00856 - Radio Antenna 
                011 - Open Circuit
    
    End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 03:28)--------------------------
    Last edited by Uwe; 04-08-2020 at 07:50 PM. Reason: CODE tags

  4. #4
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    Your friend desperately needs to update his VCDS software.

    So is that with the original clocks or the replacement? Because I see no hint of any immobilizer problem there.

    -Uwe-
    Lock-down of sick people: Quarantine
    Lock-down of healthy people: Tyranny

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    Yeah he needs to update! mine's on the latest version 20 variant.

    Yeah he has the original clocks and ECU fitted which are working fine. I changed the mileage in his replacement cluster for him, changed the vin and also the SKC in the hope that it'd plug right in and he wouldn't need to do much. 93C86 eeprom was read, decrypted, changes made and written back.

    My question is, if you tried to use the 'login' function to code in the replacement clocks and the SKC of the replacement clocks was already the same SKC as the original ecu, clocks and keys would this cause VCDS to not accept the login, as its looking for the login of the new replacement clocks to be different to the originals?

  6. #6
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave9n3 View Post
    My question is, if you tried to use the 'login' function to code in the replacement clocks and the SKC of the replacement clocks was already the same SKC as the original ecu, clocks and keys would this cause VCDS to not accept the login, as its looking for the login of the new replacement clocks to be different to the originals?
    Once someone has played around with the EEPROM data, I really don't know what to tell them.

    -Uwe-
    Lock-down of sick people: Quarantine
    Lock-down of healthy people: Tyranny

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    Professional User Jetta ,97's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave9n3 View Post
    Yeah he needs to update! mine's on the latest version 20 variant.

    Yeah he has the original clocks and ECU fitted which are working fine. I changed the mileage in his replacement cluster for him, changed the vin and also the SKC in the hope that it'd plug right in and he wouldn't need to do much. 93C86 eeprom was read, decrypted, changes made and written back.

    My question is, if you tried to use the 'login' function to code in the replacement clocks and the SKC of the replacement clocks was already the same SKC as the original ecu, clocks and keys would this cause VCDS to not accept the login, as its looking for the login of the new replacement clocks to be different to the originals?
    If is done correctly , what ever SKC(pin) you put in cluster , that will be Pin to long on with.
    On those cluster most of the time you have lock out time, even if you did not try anything before and will not allow you to put Pin. So look MBV 024 and see if you have any lock out time, if you do , wait till it go out then try Pin again.
    Master Technician for German cars
    Immobilizer/ECU
    /Cluster Programing (Used or NEW)
    Mk6 COLOR cluster in Mk5 -CLIK
    email: marinmm2001@gmail.com , info@advancedcarelectronics.com
    https://www.advancedcarelectronics.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetta ,97 View Post
    If is done correctly , what ever SKC(pin) you put in cluster , that will be Pin to long on with.
    On those cluster most of the time you have lock out time, even if you did not try anything before and will not allow you to put Pin. So look MBV 024 and see if you have any lock out time, if you do , wait till it go out then try Pin again.
    Thanks! so potentially my friend could have waited too long before he attempted to input the skc and thus it locked him out?

    I'm fairly sure the eeproms have been changed successfully, if you've worked on them before - would you mind if i sent you the two dumps? both decrypted and encrypted so you may be able to see what I've done?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uwe View Post
    Once someone has played around with the EEPROM data, I really don't know what to tell them.

    -Uwe-
    That's ok i can accept i've potentially messed things up - I was mainly wondering if the fact I made the SKC in the replacement clocks the same as the original ones could be an issue when it comes to coding. or does VCDS not care for the login code being the same as the existing. I wondered if maybe it wanted to see a different pin input to the current one before it would let you proceed with the swap? because if that was the case i'd be best just giving the replacement clocks a random SKC and telling my friend the code.

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    Quick update to possibly help someone in the future. This car is IMMO 3, but I and my friend had both been trying to code the new cluster in using module 17 - Instruments. It would never accept the SKC and thus nothing showed at channel 50 in adaptions. I was pointed in the right direction by someone and told to use module 25 - Immobiliser. Input the SKC, it was accepted and the programming can start. I'm now able to send the clocks to my friend to be coded in to his imported polo.

    Thanks to all who helped

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