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Thread: ASAM/ROD updates through the USB utility

  1. #11
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    It's the "ODX" data for modules using the data-driven UDS/ODX protocol. There's some base data on each HEX-NET, but extended, module-specific data must be downloaded based on the modules VCDS-Mobile actually finds in the car(s) being scanned in order to give the HEX-NET stand-alone capabilities on those modules. Bear in mind that modules using the UDS/ODX protocol do not have measuring value or basic setting group numbers, adaptation channel numbers, etc. This stuff is all done using identifiers that correspond back to names, and in many of these modules, even fault codes have to be run through a module-specific look-up table before we can find meaningful text for them. There's an insane amount of indirection in this data. Its' a total PITA for us compared to VWAG's old scheme, and we put a lot of effort into de-bloating it.

    -Uwe-

  2. #12
    FoRT jyoung8607's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uwe View Post
    It's the "ODX" data for modules using the data-driven UDS/ODX protocol. There's some base data on each HEX-NET, but extended, module-specific data must be downloaded based on the modules VCDS-Mobile actually finds in the car(s) being scanned in order to give the HEX-NET stand-alone capabilities on those modules.
    I think we understand, at least at an abstract level, that you need that data for UDS cars. We're good there. The fact that we need the bulk dataset plus the individual module updates does clarify things. I had seen a bunch of ASAM/ROD stuff come down in DS 29 and wondered if Mobile dynamic download of that stuff was going away.

    We can't figure out for sure how you get those ROD data updates OTA, without the Java utility.

    My personal theory is it's updating Mobile's module data wish-list... modules it's seen in an Auto-Scan and attempted to do ASAM/ROD download for, but couldn't do so at the time (for instance, if it was in standalone AP mode). Is that accurate?

    Jason

  3. #13
    Ross-Tech Employee
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    Guys let me attempt to clarify a couple of things here.

    I'm fairly sure I saw ROD files being extracted in DS 29
    This is base data that is not specific to a particular module.

    When talking to a specific module that needs UDS data, the HEX-NET will remember this. It will prompt you to download this data either when talking to the module with VCDS Mobile, when checking for other updates, or when checking for updates over USB. The rod data needed message in the USB utility means that the HEX-NET needs asam data for a module it has not downloaded yet.

    At least in principle, that is how it works. In practice, if the server is unable to locate the proper data for a module (because it is new, or there is a redirect error, for example) then you may get in a case were the HEX-NET is not able to download the data it needs. In this case, it will try again later. If you suspect a case like this, it is helpful to tell us so that we can look into what is missing.

    Best,
    --Shaun

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  5. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaun View Post
    The rod data needed message in the USB utility means that the HEX-NET needs asam data for a module it has not downloaded yet.
    But can only get them when using the USB utility ?
    Or will it try to download this when doing a Mobile scan ?

    The perplexing part is why the USB utility knows about it but the web interface does not... hence my concern.

    Ideally any time it sees a hot infrastructure connection (e.g. at my desk) it would get these updates by itself, or at least do so when you hit 'check for updates' in Mobile.
    Trying to get ASAM data when tethered is an adventure to say the least.

    I know it's already phoning home after seeing "HEX-NET is busy with the cloud" several times in VCDS Classic....


    2012 A8L 4.2 Oolong/Titanium. Premium, LED, Driver assist, Rear seat comfort, Dual pane, Alcantara, Panorama

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  7. #15
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    But can only get them when using the USB utility ?
    Or will it try to download this when doing a Mobile scan ?
    There is no difference between checking with the usb utility or talking to the module directly and being prompted to download the data. At least in theory.

    There were however a couple of redirects that were fixed recently, so if you tried with VCDS Mobile a while ago and then tried via USB recently, you may have seen different results. If you are still actively seeing different behavior between the two then it would be great if you could give us some more info on what exactly you are seeing and what modules are having the issue.

    --Shaun

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  9. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shaun View Post
    There is no difference between checking with the usb utility or talking to the module directly and being prompted to download the data. At least in theory.
    Excellent. This clarifies the USB functionality.
    I don't have a specific issue right now, but wanted to understand the differences.


    Will this eventually get rolled into the 'check for updates' in the web interface ? [the original question]

    Scenarios:
    1] Getting ready to go on an 1,100 mile trip, I update via the web interface before leaving instead of hoping there is decent cellular coverage in BFE should my vehicle have problems somewhere on the trip.
    2] I know I'll be early for a meeting so I update via the web interface before leaving instead of hoping OTA updates work and don't make me late if I decide to do a quick checkup scan at the destination
    Both of these would be while HN is in my office or on the known to work home network


    2012 A8L 4.2 Oolong/Titanium. Premium, LED, Driver assist, Rear seat comfort, Dual pane, Alcantara, Panorama

  10. #17
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakematic View Post
    Will this eventually get rolled into the 'check for updates' in the web interface ?
    In principle, it's already in there. If it's not working for you, we need specifics.

    Having it all current before leaving on a long trip is A Good Thing.

    If it completes and Auto-Scan without complaining that it's missing data, you should be Good To Go. If not, please let us know what it's missing.

    -Uwe-

  11. #18
    Administrator Andy's Avatar
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    I can confirm that after scanning my 2015 GTI (which is all UDS) with a relatively-virgin HEX-NET in AP mode, it encountered several missing ROD files. I was able to come inside, check for updates using VCDS-Mobile in Infrastructure Mode and it fetched the files needed. It took a few iterations of this so repeat as needed. If you are going on a trip without interwebz and need to make sure you have all of the files, make sure to do a complete AutoScan using VCDS-Mobile while still at home and check to make sure there are no missing ROD files.

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  13. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uwe View Post
    In principle, it's already in there. If it's not working for you, we need specifics.
    Ummm.... I did... some time ago...:
    Quote Originally Posted by jakematic View Post
    Interestingly neither HN thinks it needs and update via the web interface but the utility does, with two different results.
    Haven't done any updates in case you need additional information.




    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    I can confirm that after scanning my 2015 GTI (which is all UDS) with a relatively-virgin HEX-NET in AP mode, it encountered several missing ROD files. I was able to come inside, check for updates using VCDS-Mobile in Infrastructure Mode and it fetched the files needed. It took a few iterations of this so repeat as needed. If you are going on a trip without interwebz and need to make sure you have all of the files, make sure to do a complete AutoScan using VCDS-Mobile while still at home and check to make sure there are no missing ROD files.
    Assuming I've scanned it in the past, no modules got their module sex on and made new baby modules... shouldn't an update at my desk [edit: via the web interface] do just that ?


    2012 A8L 4.2 Oolong/Titanium. Premium, LED, Driver assist, Rear seat comfort, Dual pane, Alcantara, Panorama

  14. #20
    Benevolent Dictator Uwe's Avatar
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    Jake, can we see what it currently says please? Does it still claim "Updated ROD data needed"? Looking at those screen-shots, I'm sorta wondering if that's simply the wrong string being displayed there, 'cause it looks like it's about to get a new CFB, not new ROD data.

    -Uwe-

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