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Thread: My MKV intermittent heat and coolant loss issue

  1. #1
    Verified VCDS User golfi_vend's Avatar
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    My MKV intermittent heat and coolant loss issue

    HI

    I hope this is not going to be a long and boring story, but here goes.

    I bought my car from private seller. After i had bought it and sat in traffic jam for an hour the check coolant light came on. I topped the reservoir and hoped it would be all. Unfortunately not.
    After days of driving i noticed that heat output to cabin isn't continuous as you would expect it to be, sometimes it blows cold, sometimes normal hot.
    Sometimes it would also blow the check coolant warning. I wasn't able to diagnose where the coolant would go, but then i swa that i would blow it to coolant tank overflow.

    Having suspicions i changed the cap and thermostat for original ones. That didn't help. I kept topping the tank occasionally when needed.




    Few weeks back somebody wrote on our local VW-club that was like i've wrote it.
    Problem started after WP and timingbelt got replaced. After change i was able to drive aprox. 50km(35mi) when coolant tank got empty. I added a liter and same occured after a while. This happened about 3-times. All summer long i didn't need to add anything.
    Now in autumn when heat was needed, no heat would come, not even slightly. When revving up to 1500+ heat would come. When idling also no heat.
    The company who changed t.belt blamed t.stat. That changed, car ran fine for 2 days. After that same problems occured. The company wasn't able to give a diagnose.
    -------Few post between.
    A someone who claims to be a experieneced said that this is definitelty waterpump issue and fault of not original WP. I will let the dealer to put OE WP.
    -------Few post between.
    Still some issue. Sometimes is heat, other times not.
    -------Few post between.
    I figured it out. I took egr cooler out of coolant circuit hoping that was problem, no it wasnt.
    Than i took t-stat out. Heat in cabin all times, but coolant wont rise above 60C.
    Ideas?
    So today i took the car for testdrive/logdrive. The results via image are below:

    Download full excel sheet: https://www.dropbox.com/s/uwof7j9w0g...emps.xlsx?dl=0
    As you can see the temp. at t.stat housing drops, it's the exact time when i start maxing out my car. Also temp rises but heat in cabin stops.
    When i arrive at home and keep the car at idle heat output doesn't restore. When i start revving it slowly restores.



    Any ideas? Am seriously out of them. I'm afraid to have a bad Head or head-gasket, but if that's the case.
    I am a VW Freak - Le WV Freaks OR Come visit me at my work with ODIS concerns - FORSS ODIS GeKo/FaZit access for VW/AUDI/Škoda
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  3. #2
    Ross-Tech Employee DrPeter's Avatar
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    Hello,


    Any ideas? Am seriously out of them. I'm afraid to have a bad Head or head-gasket, but if that's the case.
    - Coolant temperature is usually around 90 - 105'C on a normal running engine, the low of 79'C is too low and would normally indicate a stuck thermostat or air around the sensor.

    - If you suspect a failed head gasket, you can purchase a "combustion gas leak detector" for checking your coolant for any trace amounts combustion gasses.
    - - Get the type that uses, combustion gas leak detection fluid.

    Like the one seen here. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_SIwHMLmkM


    - What Engine is this? There are around 6 different 2.0L diesels, you can post an Auto-Scan, that will help.


    Thank you,

    drpeter

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  5. #3
    Verified VCDS User golfi_vend's Avatar
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    Code:
    Monday,27,October,2014,23:05:53:01666
    VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator
    VCDS Version: 14.8.1.0 (x64)
    Data version: 20140905
    
    
    VIN: WVWZZZ1KZ7Wxxxxxx   License Plate: MINU GOLF BLUETOOTH
    Mileage: 189020km-117451mi   Repair Order: 
    
    
    
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    
    
    Chassis Type: 1K (7N0)
    Scan: 01 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 22 25 37 42 44 46 52 55 56 62 72 76
              77 7D
    
    VIN: WVWZZZ1KZ7xxxxxx   Mileage: 189020km-117451miles
    
    01-Engine -- Status: OK 0000
    03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
    04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
    08-Auto HVAC -- Status: Malfunction 0010
    09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: OK 0000
    15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
    16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
    17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
    19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
    22-AWD -- Status: OK 0000
    25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
    37-Navigation -- Status: OK 0000
    42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: OK 0000
    44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000
    46-Central Conv. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
    52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
    55-Headlight Range -- Status: OK 0000
    56-Radio -- Status: OK 0000
    62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: Malfunction 0010
    72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
    76-Park Assist -- Status: OK 0000
    77-Telephone -- Status: OK 0000
    7D-Aux. Heat -- Status: OK 0000
     
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 01: Engine        Labels: 03G-906-021-BMM.clb
       Part No SW: 03G 906 021 JG    HW: 03G 906 021 AB
       Component: R4 2,0L EDC G000SG  9967  
       Revision: --H06---    Serial number: VWZBZ0F0503310
       Coding: 0000172
       Shop #: WSC 74565 000 00000
       VCID: 6DD13BF174977C5202-8038
    
    No fault code found.
    Readiness: 0 0 0 0 0 
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 1K0-907-379-MK60-A.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 907 379 AB    HW: 1K0 907 379 AB
       Component: ESP 4MOTION MK60    0102  
       Revision: 00H13001    
       Coding: 0006786
       Shop #: WSC 01279 785 00200
       VCID: 72EB288D6DA9A3AADF-8027
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 08: Auto HVAC (J255)       Labels: 5K0-907-044.clb
       Part No SW: 5K0 907 044 GM    HW: 5K0 907 044 GM
       Component: Climatronic   H19 1212  
       Revision: 00001004    
       Coding: 0000000002
       Shop #: WSC 00066 123 00119
       ASAM Dataset: EV_Climatronic A01010
       ROD: EV_ClimaAutoBasis_SE36.rod
       VCID: 7CF706B5F7EDE5DA85-8029
    
    2 Faults Found:
    13701424 - Function Restricted due to Missing Message(s) 
              U1111 00 [009] - -
              Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 00000001
                        Fault Priority: 6
                        Fault Frequency: 1
                        Reset counter: 93
                        Mileage: 189020 km
                        Date: 2000.00.00
                        Time: 19:00:12
    
    13701456 - Function Restricted due to Missing Message(s) 
              U1111 00 [009] - -
              Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 00000001
                        Fault Priority: 6
                        Fault Frequency: 1
                        Reset counter: 93
                        Mileage: 189020 km
                        Date: 2000.00.00
                        Time: 19:00:12
    
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels: 3C0-937-049-23-H.lbl
       Part No SW: 3C0 937 049 E    HW: 3C0 937 049 E
       Component: Bordnetz-SG     H37 1002  
       Revision: 00H37000    Serial number: 00000006142618
       Coding: EF0A0E07001E1500001400001400000080397E0D5C
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 2B55F5E98A03B2625C-807E
    
       Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1K1 955 119 E  Labels: 1KX-955-119.CLB
       Component: Wischer 300806 020  0501  
       Coding: 00040853
       Shop #: WSC 66565  
    
       Subsystem 2 - Part No: 1K0 955 559 AH  Labels: 1K0-955-559-AG.CLB
       Component: RLS     110414 054  0403  
       Coding: 00338733
       Shop #: WSC 66565  
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 1K0-909-605.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 909 605 T    HW: 1K0 909 605 T
       Component: 37 AIRBAG VW8   020 2300  
       Revision: 05020000    Serial number: 0038PD0STKC9  
       Coding: 0013111
       Shop #: WSC 01269 785 00200
       VCID: 3D71CBB164772CD2F2-8068
    
       Subsystem 1 - Serial number: 6332MSME1329655BD
    
       Subsystem 2 - Serial number: 6342MSME120509672
    
       Subsystem 3 - Serial number: 6352QSME14301B1FD
    
       Subsystem 4 - Serial number: 6362QSME1348131DC
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 16: Steering wheel        Labels: 1K0-953-549-MY9.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 953 549 CH    HW: 1K0 953 549 CH
       Component: J0527           056 0111  
       Coding: 0000334
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 7AFB00AD35D9DBEA97-802F
    
       Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
       Component: E0221           007 0050
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 1K0-920-xxx-17.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 920 873 B    HW: 1K0 920 873 B
       Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT VDD 1610  
       Revision: V0003000    Serial number: VWZBZ0F0503310
       Coding: 0023103
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 2B55F5E98A03B2625C-807E
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 1K0-920-xxx-17.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 920 873 B    HW: 1K0 920 873 B
       Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT VDD 1610  
       Revision: V0003000    Serial number: VWZBZ0F0503310
       Coding: 0023103
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 2B55F5E98A03B2625C-807E
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 7N0-907-530-V1.clb
       Part No SW: 7N0 907 530     HW: 1K0 907 951 
       Component: J533  Gateway   H27 5603  
       Revision:   H27       Serial number: 020610F2001428
       Coding: E9837F1E40060200000002
       Shop #: WSC 74565 000 00000
       VCID: 6DD13BF174977C5202-8038
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 22: AWD        Labels: 1K0-907-554.lbl
       Part No: 1K0 907 554 F
       Component: Haldex 4Motion      0115  
       Coding: 0000001
       Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
       VCID: 306FE285A325D1BA69-8065
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 25: Immobilizer        Labels: 1K0-920-xxx-25.clb
       Part No SW: 1K0 920 873 B    HW: 1K0 920 873 B
       Component: IMMO            VDD 1610  
       Revision: V0003000    Serial number: VWZBZ0F0503310
       Shop #: WSC 01342 020 12345
       VCID: 2B55F5E98A03B2625C-807E
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 37: Navigation (J0506)       Labels: 1T0-035-680.clb
       Part No SW: 1T0 035 680 P    HW: 1T0 035 680 H
       Component: RNS-MID       H64 5238  
       Revision: AB001001    Serial number: VWZ6Z7M7174093
       Coding: 00000402040000200000
       Shop #: WSC 46949 133 86817
       VCID: 3B75C5A9BA6322E2CC-806E
    
       Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1T0 919 859 C
       Component: EU East V11  8129 
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 42: Door Elect, Driver        Labels: 1K0-959-701-MAX3.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 959 701 N    HW: 1K0 959 701 N
       Component: Tuer-SG         005 0971  
       Coding: 0000183
       Shop #: WSC 01279 785 00200
       VCID: 3979DFA1705F10F2DE-806C
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 1Kx-909-14x-44.clb
       Part No: 1K1 909 144 L
       Component: EPS_ZFLS Kl.070 H07 1806  
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 3467EE95573DED9A0D-8061
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 1K0-959-433-MAX.clb
       Part No SW: 1K0 959 433 BT    HW: 1K0 959 433 BT
       Component:    KSG PQ35 G2  020 0203  
       Revision: 00020000    Serial number: 00000000000000
       Coding: 00900A005103483E00020F0FE0000FCA507F40
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 03057D4942139A22C4-8056
    
       Subsystem 1 - Component:   Sounder No Answer     
    
       Subsystem 2 - Component:       NGS No Answer     
    
       Subsystem 3 - Component:      IRUE No Answer     
    
    4 Faults Found:
    01134 - Alarm Horn (H12) 
                000 - -
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 01100000
                        Fault Priority: 4
                        Fault Frequency: 2
                        Reset counter: 85
                        Mileage: 188780 km
                        Time Indication: 0
                        Date: 2000.00.00
                        Time: 17:03:20
    
    01134 - Alarm Horn (H12) 
                004 - No Signal/Communication
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 01100100
                        Fault Priority: 4
                        Fault Frequency: 2
                        Reset counter: 92
                        Time Indication: 0
    
    01135 - Interior Monitoring Sensors 
                004 - No Signal/Communication
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 01100100
                        Fault Priority: 4
                        Fault Frequency: 1
                        Reset counter: 92
                        Mileage: 188988 km
                        Time Indication: 0
                        Date: 2000.00.00
                        Time: 18:21:55
    
    00323 - Vehicle Inclination Sensor (G384) 
                004 - No Signal/Communication
                 Freeze Frame:
                        Fault Status: 01100100
                        Fault Priority: 4
                        Fault Frequency: 1
                        Reset counter: 92
                        Mileage: 188988 km
                        Time Indication: 0
                        Date: 2000.00.00
                        Time: 18:21:55
    
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 52: Door Elect, Pass.        Labels: 1K0-959-702-MAX3.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 959 702 N    HW: 1K0 959 702 N
       Component: Tuer-SG         005 0971  
       Coding: 0000182
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 3A7BC0AD75591BEAD7-806F
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 55: Headlight Range        Labels: 1T0-907-357.lbl
       Part No: 1T0 907 357 
       Component: Dynamische LWR      0003  
       Coding: 0000004
       Shop #: WSC 01279 785 00200
       VCID: 74E72E9517BDAD9ACD-8021
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 56: Radio (J0506)       Labels: 1T0-035-680.clb
       Part No SW: 1T0 035 680 P    HW: 1T0 035 680 H
       Component: RNS-MID       H64 5238  
       Revision: AB001001    Serial number: VWZ6Z7M7174093
       Coding: 00000402040000200000
       Shop #: WSC 46949 133 86817
       VCID: 3B75C5A9BA6322E2CC-806E
    
       Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1T0 919 859 C
       Component: EU East V11  8129 
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 62: Door, Rear Left        Labels: 1K0-959-703-GEN3.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 959 703 K    HW: 1K0 959 703 K
       Component: Tuer-SG         005 0913  
       Coding: 0000144
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 1012544
       VCID: 387FDAA54B5509FA21-806D
    
    1 Fault Found:
    00102 - Rear Left Interior Locking Button (E310) 
                008 - Implausible Signal
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 72: Door, Rear Right        Labels: 1K0-959-704-GEN3.lbl
       Part No SW: 5K0 959 704     HW: 5K0 959 704 
       Component: Tuer-SG         007 2106  
       Coding: 0000144
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 1012544
       VCID: 72EB288D6DA9A3AADF-8027
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 76: Park Assist        Labels: 1K0-919-283.lbl
       Part No: 1K0 919 283 A
       Component: 22 Einparkhilfe     0101  
       Shop #: WSC 66565 257 00032
       VCID: 2D51FBF1B417BC5242-8078
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 77: Telephone (J412)       Labels: 3C8-035-730-A.clb
       Part No SW: 3C8 035 730 D    HW: 3C8 035 730 D
       Component: Telefon       022 0982  
       Revision: --------    Serial number: 35502105137557
       Coding: 020000010100010000000101
       Shop #: WSC 12345 123 12345
       ASAM Dataset: EV_UHVPremi 002709
       ROD: EV_UHVPremi_SE36.rod
       VCID: 24471ED52FDD7D1A9D-8071
    
    No fault code found.
    
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Address 7D: Aux. Heat        Labels: 1K0-963-235.lbl
       Part No SW: 1K0 963 235 E    HW: 1K0 963 235 E
       Component: PTC-Element         0404  
       Revision: 00800000    Serial number:               
       Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
       VCID: 2D51FBF1B417BC5242-8078
    
    No fault code found.
    
    End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 02:25)--------------------------
    Upps, forgot this. The low spot in beginning is because car had been sitting in tank station parking lot. Low in end - i don't know, maybe because it's cold outside(-3C)
    Engine is BMM.

    For the coolant tester, i would need to check if anyone even sells something like this in this country. I've read about it, but never seen one in stores.
    Last edited by golfi_vend; 12-02-2014 at 08:19 PM.
    I am a VW Freak - Le WV Freaks OR Come visit me at my work with ODIS concerns - FORSS ODIS GeKo/FaZit access for VW/AUDI/Škoda
    The world is my oyster...

  6. #4
    Ross-Tech Employee DrPeter's Avatar
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    Hello,

    Thanks for the information. You may also want to check your engine oil for any coolant contamination.

    I would recommend to check the engine thermostat by removing it and placing the thermostat in a container of water, then heat the water and watch the thermostat, the opening begins at approx. 85°C and then ends at approx. 105°C. - If the thermostat fails, replace it.


    - When filling the cooling system, be sure to use G-12 coolant, it is purple and should be mixed with water to the correct temperature protection level (50%), see the container for that info.
    Maybe that could be your issue, too much water?? Is your coolant freezing?
    Drain some and place it in a container and put it in the freezer, it should not freeze, unless your freezer goes below (-35°C)


    Once full, put the cap back on tight, start the engine and increase the engine speed to about 2,000 rpm and hold it there for about 3 minutes and then idle the engine.

    Visually check the coolant level (as per the factory repair manual), this will allow the coolant to circulate and help bleed any air out.

    Then keep the engine running until the radiator fan starts, check for leaks and correct coolant level again.


    Hope this helps,

    drpeter

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  8. #5
    Verified VCDS User golfi_vend's Avatar
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    Coolant is flashed and t.stat is changed. OE, but you may never know.
    I've been using coolant they sell in stores, premixed and comes in 5L bottles.
    I am a VW Freak - Le WV Freaks OR Come visit me at my work with ODIS concerns - FORSS ODIS GeKo/FaZit access for VW/AUDI/Škoda
    The world is my oyster...

  9. #6
    Ross-Tech Employee DrPeter's Avatar
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    Coolant is flashed and t.stat is changed. OE, but you may never know.
    I've been using coolant they sell in stores, premixed and comes in 5L bottles.
    - Well if the coolant is good and the thermostat is functioning correctly, then it sounds like:

    a) Coolant is failing to circulate at times, could be a failed water pump.
    - In some cases they can fail so that at times it is pumping/circulating coolant and other times it is not, below is a really bad water pump, yours may not be as bad, but this gives you a visual.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xu3ccI3FCo
    - You can test the circulation by watching the small coolant return hose dump coolant back into the coolant bottle. If it stops or there is no coolant, the system is low on coolant(air bound) or there could be a concern with the water pump, increasing engine speed maybe necessary and this test is done at idle.

    b) There is a coolant leak and the coolant level drops below the temperature sensors and these sensors do not read 'hot air' very well, so the Measuring Value Block data shows a drop in temp.
    - In this case get a "combustion gas leak detector" and a 'Coolant system pressure tester' and check for leaks.

    c) A rare and undocumented species of self absorbing quantum fungus is present within the cooling system, slowly devouring the Ethylene Glycol and no matter how much coolant you add, it is magically diapering. In that case, call it a day, sell the car and get a 1996 GTI VR6, (that is what I drive) because it is immune to my BS story about the self absorbing quantum fungus stuff... In other words, not too sure what else it could be without further testing... lol

    Seriously hope the above (a,b) does help,

    drpeter

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  11. #7
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    Your problem sounds much like the one I had with my 1.8 A 4 I tried replacing the Tstat, heater core flushes, vacuum filling the coolant , replace hoses , coolant flange, compression tests, cylinder leak down test and replaced the head gasket. None of this fixed the problem finally replaced the head gasket and purchased a refurbished head and that fixed my problem.

  12. #8
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    I've had 3 head gasket faults over the past 7 days!! I worked for vw for 12 years and only ever replaced 1! Lol but a simple block test can confirm if exhaust has is present In your cooling system.
    The 2.0 tdi is also prone to cracking the head which you may have to watch out for too!

  13. #9
    Verified VCDS User golfi_vend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dubTECH View Post
    I've had 3 head gasket faults over the past 7 days!! I worked for vw for 12 years and only ever replaced 1! Lol but a simple block test can confirm if exhaust has is present In your cooling system.
    The 2.0 tdi is also prone to cracking the head which you may have to watch out for too!
    Does the head cracking apply also to 8v engine what i have. It looks just like a old PD 1.9, but with a increased capacity.
    I am a VW Freak - Le WV Freaks OR Come visit me at my work with ODIS concerns - FORSS ODIS GeKo/FaZit access for VW/AUDI/Škoda
    The world is my oyster...

  14. #10
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    The BKD (2.0TDI 16v PD140) engine was prone to cracking the head. I had a 2007 Octavia which suffered with that problem thanks to a revision B head, it had a revision C cylinder head fitted under warranty and it was fine after that. I'm not sure if the 8v BMM lump suffers with any issues like that. Not heard of any cases myself.

    Poor cold & hot starting and constant coolant loss were the main symptoms with the cracked head.

    Another component worth considering (if not already dismissed) is the EGR cooler. If they leak, it can be tricky to diagnose.

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