10 Jetta Wagon TDI timing belt replaced, crank-no start condition.

[aaperformance]

This vehicles original problem was drive belt tensioner gave out causing the serpentine belt to shread and get caught up into the engine timing belt. The engine timing belt jumped and car will crank but no start. With 123k miles, overdue for a timing belt replacement. After replacing the timing belt, vehicle still cranks over but will not start. An autoscan and a log of the engine while trying to start is posted below. Yes, the correct timing belt tool from metalnerd and at tdc everything lined up. please advise, thank you very much

VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 16.8.1.1 (x64)
Data version: 20160902 DS256
[url]www.Ross-Tech.com[/url]


VIN: 3VWPL7AJ8AM647442   License Plate: 


Gateway Installation List:  1K0 907 530 AD

01-Engine -- Status: Malfunction 0010
02-Auto Trans -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
1C-Position Sensing -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: Malfunction 0010
44-Steering Assist -- Status: Malfunction 0010
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: Malfunction 0010
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
65-Tire Pressure -- Status: Malfunction 0010
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
77-Telephone -- Status: Malfunction 0010

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: AJ (1K0)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 1C 25 42 44 46 52 56 62 65 72 77
         

VIN: 3VWPL7AJ8AM647442   Mileage: 198620km-123416miles

01-Engine -- Status: Malfunction 0010
02-Auto Trans -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
1C-Position Sensing -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: Malfunction 0010
44-Steering Assist -- Status: Malfunction 0010
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: Malfunction 0010
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
65-Tire Pressure -- Status: OK 0000
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
77-Telephone -- Status: Malfunction 0010
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine (CJA)       Labels: 03L-906-022-CBE.clb
   Part No SW: 03L 906 019 CM    HW: 03L 906 022 TS
   Component: R4 2,0L EDC G000AG  9971  
   Revision: 12H02---    Serial number:               
   Coding: 0050078
   Shop #: WSC 05089 444 84564
   VCID: 78D110290BDD0B8290-802C

1 Fault Found:
000833 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40) 
               P0341 - 000 - Implausible Signalp
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 01100000
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 2
                    Reset counter: 255
                    Mileage: 198623 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2011.02.25
                    Time: 00:13:01

             Freeze Frame:
                    RPM: 138 /min
                    Speed: 0.0 km/h
                    Voltage: 9.73 V
                    Temperature: 30.6°C
                    Idle Stabilization: 0.0°KW
                    RPM: 68 /min
                    (no units): 33.0

Readiness: 0 0 0 0 1 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 02E-927-770.clb
   Part No SW: 02E 300 052 T    HW: 02E 927 770 AL
   Component: GSG DSG AG6     511 2114  
   Revision:    51112    Serial number: 00000911111046
   Coding: 0000020
   Shop #: WSC 02069 000 90108
   VCID: 256F095DECEF466AFB-8070

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes (J104)       Labels: 1K0-907-379-60EC1F.clb
   Part No SW: 1K0 907 379 AJ    HW: 1K0 907 379 AJ
   Component: ESP MK60EC1   H30 0107  
   Revision: 00H30001    
   Coding: 114B600C49260001880F06E8921B0042310000
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 7AD50A21F5D11992E6-802E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC (J301)       Labels: 3C8-907-336.clb
   Part No SW: 3C8 907 336 AJ    HW: 3C8 907 336 AJ
   Component: Climatic      H14 0305  
   Revision: 00009001    
   Coding: 0000001002
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00185
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Climatic A01005
   ROD: EV_ClimaBasis_VW36.rod
   VCID: 75CF191DD4CF76EA8B-8020

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. (J519)       Labels: 1K0-937-08x-09.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 937 085 G    HW: 5K0 937 085 G
   Component: BCM PQ35 B++  111 0128  
   Revision: BI111001    
   Coding: 2D380E1A902F3EC480080001400000C401000086535D8560648020000000
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 3753D3158643C4FA59-8062

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1K1 955 119 F  Labels: 1KX-955-119.CLB
   Component: Wischer 16120  21  0512 
   Coding: 009795

1 Fault Found:
01598 - Drive Battery Voltage 
            011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00101011
                    Fault Priority: 6
                    Fault Frequency: 254
                    Reset counter: 250
                    Mileage: 170007 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2010.07.04
                    Time: 22:42:53

             Freeze Frame:
                        Term 15 On
                    Voltage: 13.30 V
                        ON
                        ON
                        OFF
                        OFF
                        OFF


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags (J234)       Labels: 5K0-959-655.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 959 655 B    HW: 5K0 959 655 B
   Component: AirbagVW10G   019 0706  
   Serial number: 003C4D07MXHP  
   Coding: 00003044
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: EV_AirbaVW10SMEVW360 A01012
   ROD: EV_AirbaVW10SMEVW360.rod
   VCID: 3957D52DB857D28AAF-806C

   Seat occupied recognition: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 1KM 959 339     HW: 1KM 959 339 
   Component: BF-Gewichtss.  007 0001 
   Serial number: ---0000R--0004YMH900

   Crash sensor for side airbag: driver side: 
   Subsystem 2 - Part No SW: 1KM 955 557     HW: 1KM 955 557 
   Component: S.Sens.Fahr.V  H01 ---- 
   Serial number: 3572MSME6B28534AZZZ%

   Crash sensor for side airbag: front passenger side: 
   Subsystem 3 - Part No SW: 1KM 955 557     HW: 1KM 955 557 
   Component: S.Sens.Beif.V  H01 ---- 
   Serial number: 3582MSME5B75524CZZZ2

   Crash sensor for side airbag: rear: driver side: 
   Component: S.Sens.Fahr.H  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 3511HSME76660F1EZZZ-

   Crash sensor for side airbag: rear: passenger side: 
   Component: S.Sens.Beif.H  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 3521HSME7A570F1EZZZ+

   Crash sensor for front airbag: driver side: 
   Component: F.Sens.Fahr  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 35527SME4231581EZZZE

   Crash sensor for front airbag: front passenger side: 
   Component: F.Sens.Beif  --- ---- 
   Serial number: 35627SME2621581EZZZG

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel        Labels: 1K0-953-549-MY9.lbl
   Part No SW: 1K0 953 549 CD    HW: 1K0 953 549 CD
   Component: J0527           056 0111  
   Coding: 0001532
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 76CD1E1101C97DF282-8022

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 5K0 959 542   Labels: 3C8-959-537.CLB
   Component: E221__MFL-TAS   H05 0010  
   Coding: 00000130
   Shop #: WSC 00000  

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments (J285)       Labels: 5K0-920-xxx-17.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 920 970 Q    HW: 5K0 920 970 Q
   Component: KOMBI         H03 0305  
   Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 270F00
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00148
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09 A04052
   ROD: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09_VW25.rod
   VCID: 3C59CC39B765E7A2B4-8068

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 1K0-907-530-V4.clb
   Part No SW: 1K0 907 530 AD    HW: 1K0 907 951 
   Component: J533  Gateway   H07 0111  
   Revision:   H07 01    Serial number: 281009F1000977
   Coding: ED807F07001602002002
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 69F7456D4077A20A1F-803C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 1C: Position Sensing        Labels: 1Kx-919-xxx-1C.lbl
   Part No SW: 5N0 919 879     HW: 5N0 919 879 
   Component: Kompass         001 0001  
   Revision: 00001000    Serial number: 1225223T6HW104
   Coding: 0000002
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 7EDD063129F935B2DA-802A

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 25: Immobilizer (J334)       Labels: 5K0-920-xxx-25.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 953 234     HW: 5K0 953 234 
   Component: IMMO          H03 0305  
   Serial number:               
   Coding: 000000
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Immo_UDS_VDD_RM09 A03005
   ROD: EV_Immo_UDS_VDD_RM09_VW21.rod
   VCID: 6AF53A618D71A91216-803E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 42: Door Elect, Driver (J386)       Labels: 3C0-959-70X-GEN4.clb
   Part No SW: 3C0 959 701 B    HW: 3C0 959 793 
   Component: TUER-SG FT    002 0307  
   Revision: 13101005    Serial number: 0000165045
   Coding: 0004B5
   Shop #: WSC 01383 790 50316
   ASAM Dataset: EV_DCU42BroseDriveSide A03004
   ROD: EV_DCU42BroseDriveSide.rod
   VCID: 277303555EE3547AC9-8072

   Slave Driver: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 1K0 959 703 AH    HW: 1K0 959 795 T  Labels: 1K0-959-70X-GEN4.CLB
   Component: J388__TSG-HL  006 1401 
   Serial number: 00000004574941      
   Coding: 000490

1 Fault Found:
66048 - Motor for Front Window Regulator 
          B11EC 54 [008] - Missing Calibration / Basic Setting
          Intermittent - Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00000001
                    Fault Priority: 7
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 250
                    Mileage: 198623 km
                    Date: 2016.10.04
                    Time: 00:29:20


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 1Kx-909-14x-44.clb
   Part No: 1K0 909 144 H
   Component: EPS_ZFLS Kl. 70     2901  
   Revision: 00H15000    
   Shop #: WSC 02069 000 90108
   VCID: 2F43EB75BE130C3A01-807A

1 Fault Found:
03803 - Steering Angle Sensor for Steering Aid 
            000 -  -  - MIL ON
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 11100000
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 255
                    Time Indication: 0

             Freeze Frame:
                    Battery Volts: 12.7 V
                        PD
                    Temperature: 33.0°C
                    Count: 2
                    Steering Angle: 0.00°
                    Count: 0
                        SteerAng n.Init


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 52: Door Elect, Pass. (J387)       Labels: 3C0-959-70X-GEN4.clb
   Part No SW: 3C0 959 702 B    HW: 3C0 959 792 
   Component: TUER-SG BT    002 0307  
   Revision: 15101005    Serial number: 0000164770
   Coding: 0004B4
   Shop #: WSC 01383 790 50316
   ASAM Dataset: EV_DCU52BrosePasseSide A03004
   ROD: EV_DCU52BrosePasseSide.rod
   VCID: 2871006953FD5B02C0-807C

   Slave Passenger: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 1K0 959 704 AH    HW: 1K0 959 794 T  Labels: 1K0-959-70X-GEN4.CLB
   Component: J389__TSG-HR  006 1401 
   Serial number: 00000004556915      
   Coding: 000490

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio (J503)       Labels: 5M0-035-1xx-56.clb
   Part No SW: 1K0 035 180 AC    HW: 1K0 035 180 AC
   Component: Radio Prem-8  H10 0035  
   Revision: -----20S    Serial number: VWZ4Z7J3050641
   Coding: 0500040004
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 61E75D4D7847EA4AC7-8034

1 Fault Found:
02635 - Tuner Not Enabled/Activated 
            000 -  - 
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 01100000
                    Fault Priority: 3
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 210
                    Mileage: 198623 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2011.02.25
                    Time: 00:29:19


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure (J502)       Labels: 1K0-937-08x-65.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 937 085 G    HW: 5K0 937 085 G
   Component: RDK           111 0821  
   Coding: 018705
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 3753D3158643C4FA59-8062

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 77: Telephone (J738)       Labels: 1K8-035-730.clb
   Part No SW: 1K8 035 730 C    HW: 1K8 035 730 C
   Component: Telefon       H08 6600  
   Revision: 00008000    Serial number: 20389520277571
   Coding: 412100
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 2977056D40F7620ADF-807C

1 Fault Found:
00446 - Function Limitation due to Under-Voltage 
            000 -  -  - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00100000
                    Fault Priority: 3
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 250
                    Mileage: 198623 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2011.02.25
                    Time: 17:30:16


End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 01:59)--------------------------

 

[ivagp]

have u checked cam sensor for damage or the wiring. if no damage recheck timing

 

[Jack@European_Parts]

Ahhhhhh

Did you check compression and for a valve to piston collision from the thrown cam belt?

 

[aaperformance]

Compression is over 300 psi for each cylinder. With no glow plugs, engine cranks rap

Ahhhhhh

Did you check compression and for a valve to piston collision from the thrown cam belt?

With no glow plugs, engine cranks rapidly. We ran a test cranking the car with one glow plug installed at a time and as the each glow plug is put back one at a time, the engine once again begins to have trouble turning over. Cranking at a very low rpm. Battery and Starter are new. Please advice, maybe what should we datalog with the ross-tech as were cranking the engine to try to pinpoint the no start condition

 

[ivagp]

can u be more specific on psi

 

[Jack@European_Parts]

Car is out of time........regardless of what you think lines up or cam sensor was damaged during FOD interference or internal damage that is yet to be verified properly.

 

[ivagp]

Jack tempo! tempo!

 

[Jack@European_Parts]

?Keyways? can be damaged and everything appears to line up............
Voltages during cranking are below specified requirement.

 

[aaperformance]

(TIME STAMP) (RPM) (INJECTION QUANTITY) (ACTUAL FUEL PSI) (COOLANT TEMP) (TIME STAMP) (RPM) (SPECIFIED FUEL PSI) (ACTUAL FUEL PSI) (HIGH FUEL PRESSURE CONTROL VALVE%) (TIME STAMP) (RPM) (SPECIFIED FUEL PSI) (ACTUAL FUEL PSI)(CONTROL VALVE %)


00.35 000 34.9 296 21.6 00.09 000 296 27.6 00.21 000 296 296 35.5
00.74 000 34.9 296 21.6 00.48 000 296 27.6 00.60 000 296 296 35.5
01.12 115 34.9 344 21.6 00.86 000 296 27.6 01.00 000 296 296 35.5
01.51 230 22.8 432 21.6 01.25 115 336 43.4 01.37 184 360 480 45.0
01.88 161 22.8 312 21.6 01.63 230 368 27.6 01.76 230 368 360 45.0
02.29 207 23.3 328 21.6 02.04 184 352 28.4 02.17 230 368 312 45.0
02.69 230 24.7 336 21.6 02.41 184 360 32.4 02.57 184 352 392 45.0
03.07 184 25.5 376 21.6 02.81 207 368 28.4 02.93 184 360 416 44.2
03.45 207 27.2 368 21.6 03.20 230 352 26.0 03.33 230 368 368 43.4
03.84 230 28.5 304 21.6 03.59 184 360 31.6 03.72 184 352 352 45.8
04.23 184 29.9 392 21.6 03.96 207 368 30.8 04.11 184 360 360 46.6
04.62 184 30.7 416 21.6 04.35 230 360 26.0 04.48 230 368 400 44.2
05.00 069 31.3 360 21.6 04.74 184 360 26.0 04.87 138 344 360 36.3
05.39 000 31.3 312 21.6 05.14 069 296 21.3 05.27 000 296 320 36.3
05.78 000 31.3 304 21.6 05.51 000 296 20.5 05.65 000 296 304 36.3
06.17 000 31.3 296 21.6 05.91 000 296 20.5 06.02 000 296 304 35.5
06.54 000 31.3 296 21.6 06.29 000 296 20.5 06.42 000 296 296 35.5
06.93 000 31.3 296 21.6 06.69 000 296 20.5 06.81 000 296 296 35.5
07.34 000 31.3 296 21.6 07.07 000 296 20.5 07.21 000 296 296 35.5
07.73 000 31.3 296 21.6 07.46 000 296 20.5 07.59 000 296 296 35.5
08.10 000 31.3 296 21.6 07.85 000 296 20.5 07.98 000 296 296 35.5
08.50 000 31.3 296 21.6 08.25 000 296 20.5 08.37 000 296 296 35.5
08.89 000 31.3 296 21.6 08.63 000 296 20.5 08.76 000 296 296 35.5
09.27 000 31.3 296 21.6 09.01 000 296 20.5 09.13 000 296 296 35.5
09.66 000 31.3 296 21.6 09.40 000 296 20.5 09.53 000 296 296 35.5
10.04 000 31.3 296 21.6 09.80 000 296 20.5 09.92 000 296 296 35.5
10.43 000 31.3 296 21.6 10.17 000 296 20.5 10.31 000 296 296 35.5
10.83 000 31.3 296 21.6 10.55 000 296 20.5 10.68 000 296 296 35.5
11.20 000 31.3 296 21.6 10.95 000 296 20.5 11.07 000 296 296 35.5
11.59 000 31.3 296 21.6 11.34 000 296 20.5 11.46 000 296 296 35.5
11.98 000 31.3 296 21.6 11.71 000 296 20.5 11.86 000 296 296 35.5
12.38 000 31.3 296 21.6 12.10 000 296 20.5 12.23 000 296 296 35.5
12.76 000 31.3 296 21.6 12.51 000 296 21.3 12.64 000 296 296 35.5
13.15 000 31.3 296 21.6 12.90 000 296 20.5 13.02 000 296 296 35.5
13.54 000 31.3 296 21.6 13.28 000 296 21.3 13.42 000 296 296 35.5
13.93 000 31.3 296 21.6 13.67 000 296 21.3 13.79 000 296 296 35.5
14.31 000 31.3 296 21.6 14.06 000 296 21.3 14.19 000 296 296 35.5

 

[Jack@European_Parts]

That's a pretty slow crank speed.......

 

[aaperformance]

ok so here is what we have gathered so far. car broke the serpentine belt tensioner that caused the serpentine belt to be sucked in at the crank pulley and wedged it self to the crank timing gear and it caused the timing belt to jump timing. car was driving perfectly until then. we took it all apart and installed a new water pump and timing belt. we confirmed timing marks with the proper tools about 10 yet no start. engine sound like it wants to fire but sounds like if we had crossed ignition wires on a gas engine its like it fires on 1 cylinder then the other cylinder fire in the up stroke and engine slows down. so we did a compression test and we can get 300psi out of all the cylinders after about 6 revs. starter was getting weak we thought with all the attempts to start the engine and it was beginning to smell so we changed it. then we read that back pressure can caused the no start so i just pulled the 02 sensor by the turbo and then i noticed the smoke coming as engine is turned over. smoke is whitish in color and and has a diesel smell to it. so i take it its unburned fuel. there is no coolant in the car at the moment so it cant be coolant. next i took the exhaust pipe from the egr by throttle body and again we can see a lot of the smoke as engine is turned over. as that happened i noticed the sound of air coming from the intake so i grabbed a piece of paper and put it by the inlet pipe and confirmed there is air coming out of the intake pipe as engine is turn over this is similar to putting a piece of paper at a tail pipe. it is my opinion at this time that we have at least 2 bent intake valves. if there was excess back pressure the pipe removal from the egr would alleviate it and engine should have started. so i rule out back pressure as a problem. why i get 300 psi compression is a question i don't have an answer to. we have a cylinder leak down so i will try to use that to confirm what cylinder{s} is not sealing up.

 

[ivagp]

Fyi 300 is very low

 

[Jack@European_Parts]

Looks like it has internally kissed you while playing the xylophone .

Kiss meaning....... valves have hit pistons and are not sealing proper, further explains the no start issue + weak CR or a keyway is broke.

That is all..........

NostrJackAss Has Spoken!


Xylophone is like this when the TDI plays a Harp!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kpZbG6gMoO4

 

[Jetta 97]

I can not remember 100% now ,
What happens on CR engines when they jump t/belt, the camshaft jumps inside and it is not align anymore. Something with rocker arms , like I said I can not remember very good, it was years ago when I have seen this problem.
Anyway, you have to pull head and rebuild it .

And your drive belt jump not because of the tensioner , it jump out because of the alternator pulley is lock up. You need to chnage alternator pulley. Those pulleys are one way free and other way works as normal pulley. ANd they need to be check every service at 10000 .
This is not just problem on CR engine, in all TDI engine this is a problem. And Of course in Gas/Petrol engine as well.