Sell me on EVs.... VAG or otherwise...

[BlueR32]

Pioneers are known to end up with a lot of arrows in their backs...

 

[Crasher]

503 faults… 503!

 

[BlueR32]

To quote a senior engineer at a Germany car maker: "We find the defect volume to be acceptable". I informed him it wasn't acceptable to me or other customers. He was pretty speechless at that point.

Decision by committee or via statistics may work for a multi-national corporation that doesn't understand why their sales are tanking but it often doesn't work for consumers. GM's ~600,000 current V-8 engine recall (L87), is definitely hurting the brands rep.

 

[Uwe]

GM's ~600,000 current V-8 engine recall (L87), is definitely hurting the brands rep.

And GM isn't the only one. When GM used to have issues, people used to say, "You should have bought a Toyota". Well, Toyota has now recalled ~225,000 of their 3.4L twin-turbo V6 engines; they are also experiencing serious mechanical problems with main bearings.

-Uwe-

 

[Cuzoe]

Because I am scared (scarred, even)... that Q6 scan is from a car that is driving around? That looks like the first auto scan after updating gateway software. Though maybe I had fewer faults... All explained by nothing being able to communicate with the gateway for the three or four minutes it took to flash.

 

[Uwe]

that Q6 scan is from a car that is driving around?

Yup. It's a daily driver, and around the Christmas & New Year holidays, it did SE PA -> NE FL and back.

If you didn't have a scan tool, you wouldn't know. Well, except perhaps for occasional dodgy behavior from the door locks; I don't recall whether that ever got fixed.

-Uwe-

 

[BlueR32]

And GM isn't the only one. When GM used to have issues, people used to say, "You should have bought a Toyota". Well, Toyota has now recalled ~225,000 of their 3.4L twin-turbo V6 engines; they are also experiencing serious mechanical problems with main bearings.

-Uwe-

Yup these serious engine defects are becoming the "norm" which ain't acceptable to most consumers. The estimate for GM's engine issue is a cost of a billion dollars. That doesn't include the customers lost forever... Apparently "when you are too big to fail"... these problems don't matter. It's just the cost of doing business.

 

[Crasher]

There are noises being made about these thin oils, with VAG, there is some suggestion the failure of DADA code engines is due to the 0w/20 oil. It is just yet another example of insane tailpipe emissions standards comprising design and longevity. When I first started working on water cooled VW rubbish, I could do a head gasket on a GTI in a day, including taking to the engineers and going back to pick it up; now you are looking at a week IF all goes to plan and some critical part isn’t on Germany back order.

 

[BlueR32]

There are noises being made about these things oils, with VAG, these is some suggestion the failure of DADA code engines is due to the 0w/20 oil. It is just yet another example of insane tailpipe emissions standards comprising design and longevity. When I first started working on water cooled VW rubbish, I could do a head gasket on a GTI in a day, including taking to the engineers and going back to pick it up; now you are looking at a week IF all goes to plan and some critical part isn’t on Germany back order.

IME the current engines are excessively complex because auto makers are fighting for minute MPG gains that typically are not realized in normal use. For consumers who don't understand the tradeoffs, MPG can be a major sales point to many consumers so car makers are fighting for every bit of MPG they can find - but it can come at a cost to consumers/mfgs..

0w-20 is a perfect example. GM and some others only specify 0w-20 for U.S. sold vehicles. Elsewhere they specify 5w-30/40. GM's (L87) engine issues is reported to be out of spec crank journal finish specifications that were not detected before engine assembly. Why it took 4 years to discover the issue is unclear.

Obviously engines can be made to run on 0w-20 without terminal failure but they may in fact have higher wear over time based on actual wear test results. One issue comes from variable oil pressure oil pumps that reduce oil pressure to reduce parasitic loss to improve MPG. Getting the necessary oil pressure exactly correct for all engine speeds and loads is extremely difficult. This has led to engine problems.

 

[Uwe]

IME the current engines are excessively complex because auto makers are fighting for minute MPG gains

Agreed. Except in Europe, it's not MPG gains, but reducing grams of C02 emitted, which of course is really the same thing.

Now we should ask: Is it consumers who asked for these minuscule gains?

-Uwe-

 

[BlueR32]

Agreed. Except in Europe, it's not MPG gains, but reducing grams of C02 emitted, which of course is really the same thing.

Now we should ask: Is it consumers who asked for these minuscule gains?

-Uwe-

You and your rhetorical questions... You know dang well that no one with a brain ever asks for this foolishness. Big Brother decides how we should live because they are "all knowing". With climate "ExSperts" like Al Gore we should all be dead by now.

 

[NZDubNurd]

My 1997 land rover is *just* about to pass the point that it's fuel usage would have paid for a brand new VW Tayron R-line

The thing is... this POS, "unreliable", Land Rover has ALREADY lasted longer than an average Tayron ever will! I mean... it's only done 210K kms (130K miles) - it's just REALLY hungry

The dumbest part about new cars, is they have become MASSIVE, and still can't fit me, my wife and my 3 boys properly - better off being "compact" in our 20 year old Tourans than sitting in giant cars designed for only 4 arses, like thy make now.

Governments have a LOT to answer for. Shame we can't shoot them all.

 

[BlueR32]

My 1997 land rover is *just* about to pass the point that it's fuel usage would have paid for a brand new VW Tayron R-line

The thing is... this POS, "unreliable", Land Rover has ALREADY lasted longer than an average Tayron ever will! I mean... it's only done 210K kms (130K miles) - it's just REALLY hungry

The dumbest part about new cars, is they have become MASSIVE, and still can't fit me, my wife and my 3 boys properly - better off being "compact" in our 20 year old Tourans than sitting in giant cars designed for only 4 arses, like thy make now.

Governments have a LOT to answer for. Shame we can't shoot them all.

Those large vehicles that only seat four people are made for U.S. "wide bodies"...

 

[Crasher]

Another example of miniscule Co2 reduction "technologies" is the PTFE oil seal, how much they reduce Co2 by per km I don't know but I do know they are unreliable, fussy to instal and made from "forever chemical" (PFAS) that there is talk of banning in Europe.

 

[UranoMausBosch]

Stratospherically out of my mortal budget, but I'm quite intrigued by new Luce - basically the first Ferrari I think I'm curious about, in the sense of actually wanting to try/drive/own?! one.
Long-ish, a bit high-concept design -

What They Copied

Jony Ive built the iPhone. The car industry copied the screen. The Ferrari Luce is Ive trying to teach them again.

www.prndlcars.com

Makes me even more satisfied with my eGolf - knobs, buttons that click, an actual PNRD shifter, normal stalks for wipers/signals, dial for lights, gauges with needles - read in peripheral vision!, sensible ergonomics...
Quality materials (leather on wheel, shift lever) and fitment - all for several zeros less than Luce!

Reminds me of another EV story - though not 'Convince anyone to get one'
About a week after I got my car, I had a chance to drive a Mercedes-Benz EQS AMG sedan - I was slightly nervous that my humble 'Voltzwagen' would no longer seem so special after driving a $6-figure+ rocket ship...
It was faster, Impressive stereo, riding in back seat was fabulous!! - but to drive?! Ugh. I couldn't stand it and gladly handed the keys back.
It weighs 2x eGolf with over 5x the horsepower - but steering feel..meh, driver ergonomics (just adjusting seat/wheel) was horrid - handling didn't feel inspiring, even if on-paper it might be 'better' than eGolf. Lots of German designers at ta Mannheim rave lighting/LED features/heads-up display/etc - but completely non-intuitive controls and definitely not 'fun' to drive.

update: Used low-mileage EQS AMG are now about the same price as a new eGolf... still not interested though!

 

[BlueR32]

Just in case anyone was wondering if EV battery fires are decreasing as car makers abandon EV production... the answer is no.

Jaguar Land Rover recalls 2,300 EVs in US over extreme fire risk

I'm sure Jaguar owners are not happy that their EV is likely to catch fire.

 

[Crasher]

The ID4 in the USA is under notice for recall, the advice is to park it away from anything flammable, charging or not. Fucking insanity…

 

[BlueR32]

The ID4 in the USA is under notice for recall, the advice is to park it away from anything flammable, charging or not. Fucking insanity…

The EV recalls and park away from flammables or do not drive at all seem to be pretty frequent these days. Some of the ICE vehicles are also adopting this defect mentality.

 

[Crasher]

At least you can put out a minor ICE conflagration with a hand held fire extinguisher and not need the local fire stations entire fleet of engines plus local water main pickup JUST to stop it spreading to the local infrastructure and subsequent ground water contamination with heavy metals and other evil chemicals.

 

[BlueR32]

At least you can put out a minor ICE conflagration with a hand held fire extinguisher and not need the local fire stations entire fleet of engines plus local water main pickup JUST to stop it spreading to the local infrastructure and subsequent ground water contamination with heavy metals and other evil chemicals.

Agreed. The problem with EV battery fires is that it's a chemical reaction that will consume the entire battery/vehicle even with the fire dept. spraying water on it to cool the essentially "nuclear reactor type of meltdown". Another major issue with EV batteries is that they can self-combust without even being in use. With a typical ICE vehicle any fire is typically when the vehicle is in operation, thus not parked in your garage/home or similar building. EV batteries that have been "extinguished" have actually re-ignited weeks or months later with the damaged vehicle sitting inoperable in a wreck yard. Damaged EV batteries are very unpredictable and a serious fire hazard that isn't experienced with ICE vehicles.