Resolved 2005 VW Beetle J706 error

[Uwe]

Please Uwe, or anyone else, is this information about the module index\dataset? (I think 0811)

No 0811 is version of the part number 6Q0 909 605 AL software in that module.

The Index or Color Code is what identifies the dataset, in your example, 01.

-Uwe-

 

[rvralph64]

That ^^^ there is quite possibly erroneous voltage measurements that may confuse you and anyone reading.


First and foremost you have no Ground !!! Nothing can work without a ground - No !! it cannot !!

Then I guess you are measuring a Signal Wire with a Voltmeter and getting confusing / wrong results.


Where should the Ground be and why do you not have it ??

Hi Dr Sheldon, I was asked to measure the voltages and do recall in a previous post measuring ground but I will go back and recheck for ground.

 

[rvralph64]

Here are the test results from today. I cut a j706 harness that I had as a spare so I could test through the T10 connector. I included a picture.

MEDIA=imgur]yDx33hc[/MEDIA]

2005 Beige retest
T10 connector using cut male wire harness as pig tails.

T10r/2 .5 ohms
T10r/9 .5 ohms
T10r/1 0 v, 0 ohms
T10r/3 6.2v
T10r/8. 11.1v
Battery voltage 12.1v

 

[rvralph64]

No 0811 is version of the part number 6Q0 909 605 AL software in that module.

The Index or Color Code is what identifies the dataset, in your example, 01.

-Uwe-

I made sure the replacement was an exact match, including the index number. Perhaps the replacement is also defective evethough it's not showing up as defective? The cabling between the airbag module and j706 appears to be good. The 2006 has an AL not AF so I can't swap to compare.

 

[Dr Sheldon]

I included a picture.

I dont see a picture !

Your testing is flawed.


The Powers and Grounds need to be tested at the Component !

The Signal needs to be tested at the Module ! - Being Bi Directional then it needs to be equal at both ends !!

The signal cannot be measured with a Voltmeter.


You are still ignoring the fact that having a good ground is essential !! Not an option !!

 

[rvralph64]

Ok. I will test with the seat connected and probe the wires. What do you mean by "needs to be equal on both ends?". Are you talking about from the airbag module to j706 or from the T10 connector to J706? If not a voltmeter, then what? I do understand the importance of ground and the only wire that is dead is the T10r/1 which by the wiring diagram, I understand it leads to the dash. I have access to the wiring diagram and I can see where the 5 wires go. Yellow and Brn/blue have power and go to the airbag module. Brn and Brn/yellow are ground. Black goes to the dash. I also tested for continuity on the yellow and Brn/yellow wiring between the T10 connector and the airbag module which is a moot point since I do have power at the T10 connector.

I think that you're telling me that these two wires between the airbag module and the j706 are bi-directional and that the voltage should be equal but there's a 5v difference and that's a sign that's something is wrong.

I have stared at the J706 wiring diagram for so long that I have it almost memorized in my head. I really appreciate your help and I will not give up until I if it out. In the meantime, the 2006 is coming together great after two weeks since I purchased it. The trouble maker, the 2005, I have had it since January and it's all torn apart from me tracing the wiring.

 

[Dr Sheldon]

I have stared at the J706 wiring diagram for so long that I have it almost memorized in my head. I really appreciate your help and I will not give up until I if it out. In the meantime, the 2006 is coming together great after two weeks since I purchased it. The trouble maker, the 2005, I have had it since January and it's all torn apart from me tracing the wiring.

Stop talking about 2 cars in the same thread !!

No one cares about the other one !! Concentrate on the one you need help with.

You are confusing things !!

 

[rvralph64]

Got it

 

[Apendiixator]

I do understand the importance of ground and the only wire that is dead is the T10r/1 which by the wiring diagram,

Your diagram does not show what electrical connection no. 20 is marked with (T10r\1). But according to the color of the wire (sw), it is probably terminal "15". That is, +12V after turning on the key. (Is that what it says in the diagram?) If so, I think it must definitely not be dead. If you cannot measure voltage on it, then the J706 unit is not powered. In such a case, it is enough to provisionally apply voltage to pin T10r\1. Then you will see if the error in VCDS is gone.​

 

[rvralph64]

Good morning. According to my testing, T10r/1 is dead. I will try your suggestion.

Thanks

 

[rvralph64]

Here is the auto scan after jumping T10r/1 with battery voltage. i now have commumication but J706 is now reported as defective. I need to replace J706 and trace back the T10r/1 for power source.

Making progress.

Tuesday,22,April,2025,18:48:15:07661
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 11 x64
VCDS Version: 25.3.1.0 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4671.4
Data version: 20250408 DS365.0
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: 3VWCD31Y85M316819   License Plate: 2005 BEIGE
Mileage: 117800km-73197mi   Repair Order:


Chassis Type: 1Y (1Y - VW New Beetle Cab (2003 > 2010))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 17 19 25 26 29 35 37 39 46 54 56 65 75
 
VIN: 3VWCD31Y85M316819   Mileage: 117800km-73197miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 09G-927-750.clb
   Part No: 09G 927 750 AN
   Component: AQ 250 6F           0609 
   Coding: 0000008
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 7DA7E9DDD1E0B032E4D-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ESP-F.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 907 379 M
   Component: ESP FRONT MK60      0102 
   Coding: 0019970
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 34310CF9A22AB17A5B3-5160

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 1T0-909-605.lbl
   Part No: 6Q0 909 605 AF
   Component: 01 AIRBAG VW71      0609 
   Coding: 0012337
   Shop #: WSC 00066 000 00000
   VCID: 7BA3E7C5CFF4BE02DA9-5160

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1C0 959 339 B
   Component: BF-Gewichtsens. 006 0006

3 Faults Found:
01217 - Side Airbag Igniter; Driver Side (N199)
            001 - Upper Limit Exceeded
02511 - Control Module for Seat Occupied Recognition (J706)
            014 - Defective
00591 - Seat Belt Switch; Driver (E24)
            006 - Short to Plus - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 1C0-920-x4x.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 920 951 N
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. M73 V02 
   Coding: 11234
   Shop #: WSC 00000 
   VCID: 2C0114997F1AE9BA033-4B00
   3VWCD31Y85M316819     VWZ5Z0D9051151

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.clb
   Part No: 6N0 909 901
   Component: Gateway K<->CAN    V022 
   Coding: 00006
   Shop #: WSC 00066 
   VCID: 70B9C0E993B2CD5A7FB-4B1E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 26: Auto Roof        Labels: 1Y0-959-255-HYD.lbl
   Part No: 1Y0 959 255
   Component:  VSG  NBC           3405 
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 7DA7E9DDD1E0B032E4D-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 1C0-959-799.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 959 799 G
   Component: 6J Komfortgerát HLO 0004 
   Coding: 00256
   Shop #: WSC 00066 
   VCID: 3B2327C58A747E029A9-4B00

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1Y1959801C
   Component: 6J Tõrsteuer.FS KLO 0005 

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 1Y1959802D
   Component: 6J Tõrsteuer.BF KLO 0005 

   Subsystem 3 - Part No: 1Y0959811
   Component: Tõrsteuer.HL KLO 0005 

   Subsystem 4 - Part No: 1Y0959812
   Component: 6J Tõrsteuer.HR KLO 0001 

No fault code found.

End----(Elapsed Time: 03:49, VBatt start/end: 11.8V/11.7V. VIgn 11.7V)-----
------------------------------3 Faults Found-------------------------------

 

[Apendiixator]

I'm glad you found the direction.
You found the reason why the seat unit can't communicate. But I think you're where you were at the beginning. The loss of voltage on T10r\1 is probably a consequence of previous measurements. In your schematic that you posted, 0Volt is indicated for electrical node no. 20, which is marked as ground (I don't think that's correct) But you have to take into account what Erwin writes in the legend for node no. 20. Only after your communication with Dr. Sheldon did I understand where the power supply of your unit is missing.

O.K. Error 02511 is repeated just like in your first post. When you compare these two scans A and B (I mean the first and the last one), address 01 is missing on B. On A, the subsystem and also the coding are missing. Does this mean something in combination with post #50? On such repairs where you try different combinations of different parts used, it is not easy to keep your attention and you have to find only the essential information from all the information. A lot of irrelevant information will distort your judgment and take you away from the real problem.

Kind regards

 

[Apendiixator]

Are you talking about from the airbag module to j706 or from the T10 connector to J706? If not a voltmeter, then what?

This is measured with an oscilloscope.

 

[rvralph64]

I'm glad you found the direction.
You found the reason why the seat unit can't communicate. But I think you're where you were at the beginning. The loss of voltage on T10r\1 is probably a consequence of previous measurements. In your schematic that you posted, 0Volt is indicated for electrical node no. 20, which is marked as ground (I don't think that's correct) But you have to take into account what Erwin writes in the legend for node no. 20. Only after your communication with Dr. Sheldon did I understand where the power supply of your unit is missing.

O.K. Error 02511 is repeated just like in your first post. When you compare these two scans A and B (I mean the first and the last one), address 01 is missing on B. On A, the subsystem and also the coding are missing. Does this mean something in combination with post #50? On such repairs where you try different combinations of different parts used, it is not easy to keep your attention and you have to find only the essential information from all the information. A lot of irrelevant information will distort your judgment and take you away from the real problem.

Kind regards

Yes, it does appear that I am where I started but at least I understand what's going on. As I see it, I need to figure out why T10r/1 has no power. I also need to replace the J706 but I am unsure how it relates to airbag module. I have 6 J706 modules and they are all being rejected as defective and I have lost track as to which one was the one that originally came with the car. Is there a specific model number that J706 that needs to be matched with the airbag module?

This is my interpretation of the wiring diagram. The yellow and Brn/blue are the network cables, the black cable T20r/1 is the power source for J706 and there are two ground wires Brn and Brn/yellow. I downloaded the VW wiring diagram so I am going to trace back the power source for the black wire. I will retest the fuses.

 

[rvralph64]

This is measured with an oscilloscope.

Ok.

 

[Apendiixator]

I have 6 J706 modules and they are all being rejected as defective

If you are 100% sure of the continuity of the wire between the airbag units and J706 then the reason may be in the airbag unit. If you have the possibility of a verified and functional combination of the airbag unit and the seat from another car, you can mount this functional combination in your beetle. Or just the airbag module.

I have lost track as to which one was the one that originally came with the car.

Every module is identified in VCDS. I think that the identification is always unique. That can help you.


As Uwe said. If the functionality of the unit is guaranteed by the index, in your case (01) then J706 should work and the fault may be FOR EXAMPLE at the opposite end in the airbag unit. Because airbag address 15 is the one that communicates with VCDS. I cannot judge how the functionality of the J706 unit may or may not change depending on the software. I have no practical experience with PODS. In the scans you sent, the software number is always different.

 

[rvralph64]

Yes, I am 100% sure about the continuity of the wiring. I will admit that I completely botched this project. I should have kept the original airbag module and J706 instead of throwing them out! Now that I understand that the T10r/1 is the power source and if I still had the original airbag and j706, I could resolve the issue by fixing the lack of power on the T10r/1 which I still need to work on.

However, it has turned into a valuable lesson on why part swapping is a bad practice and I can already hear Dr Shelton laughing but that's ok. I will get myself out of this mess once I find a known good working airbag and j706 modules, even if I have to order them new. I just wish I knew what j706 goes with which airbag module. Is there is a list of part numbers that match airbag module 6Q0 909 605AF index number 06 09. That's the part number and index number off the original airbag module that came with car. I at least kept a picture of it when I removed it.

The plus side to all this is that every problem is a learning experience. I apologize to all who have contributed and for having wasted your time.

 

[rvralph64]

Oh, just for shits and giggles I hooked up an AL airbag module instead of the AF I am playing with and did notice that on the AL I do have access to the basic settings. I thought that was interesting. Yes, I know it's not the correct one but was curious to see what VCDS would show and I noticed the difference in no basics settings in the AF vs having access to basic settings in the AL.

 

[Apendiixator]

Yes, I am 100% sure about the continuity of the wiring.

This would mean that the whole problem lies in the defect of at least one component (airbag module and/or PODS module). Or simply in mutual incompatibility.

I should have kept the original airbag module and J706 instead of throwing them out!

Original airbag module. I assume you mean the one from the first scan:

Part No: 6Q0 909 605 AF Component: 01 AIRBAG VW71 0609

It doesn't have to be original. It doesn't have to be an original PODS unit either. You would have to know the history of the car in detail.

I will get myself out of this mess once I find a known good working airbag and j706 modules

In the previous communication you talked about another Beetle that you have available and that does not have a problem with PODS. If you take advantage of that and install both units (i.e. airbag module and PODS) then you will be sure of what you need to do.

Is there is a list of part numbers that match airbag module 6Q0 909 605AF index number 06 09.

Such a list does not officially exist. However, there is a way to determine with certainty which airbag module and PODS fit your Beetle. And that way you will get an answer to the mutual compatibility of both components. It is ETKA with the fi function. At least for European cars after 2000 it works. The exception to the fi function is only in a few cases which are always clearly marked in the ETKA catalogue. The easiest way to get to the ETKA catalogue with the intelligent spare part assignment function will be through an official dealer in your country.

That's the part number and index number off the original airbag module that came with car.

In my ETKA catalog (old version 7.0 without Fí function) I see that the airbag unit xxx xxx 605 AM (two indexes) 605 AF (one index) 605 AL (four indexes) was installed in the 2005 Beetle Cabrio. There are many options. If ETKA 7.0 helps you, write and I can send you this program with zero customs duty :-) It can help you with your projects on older VW cars,

Kind regards and don't worry

 

[Apendiixator]

I hooked up an AL airbag module instead of the AF I am playing with and did notice that on the AL I do have access to the basic settings.

I'm sure that if the module allows basic settings, you have to do it. Otherwise, the repair will not work correctly.