Passat B5.5 1.8T - 17748 Code

[duxdweller]

Hi all. I've been struggling to fully repair my 2004 Passat. Began by not starting several weeks ago. Ran VCDS and got two timing codes:

16395 - Bank 1 Camshaft A (intake) P0411 -008 Retard setpoint not reached (over-advanced) - intermittent - MIL ON

16725 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40) P0341 -004 - Implausible signal - MIL ON

I had it towed to a shop - they replaced the CPS. Car started but ran rough and had very reduced power. I took it home and re-scanned. Now it had the following fault:

16725 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40) P0341 -004 - Implausible signal - MIL ON

Opened up the valve cover to find that the CTT had a piece of the plastic guide broken off and signs that the chain had been rubbing the valve cover. So - I replaced the CCT - VERY CAREFULLY installed and check the camshaft timing and belt timing (belt was done a year or so ago), put on new gaskets and restarted it. Starts like a charm now and above 1200 RPM runs like a top. But - idles like crap (won't stall but is super rough). MIL is gone - but I have a new code:

Tuesday,04,February,2025,15:40:34:43966
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 24.7.1.0 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4654.4
Data version: 20240919 DS356.3
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: WVWPD63B34P157036   License Plate: TEDDY
Mileage: 303140km-188362mi   Repair Order: 


Chassis Type: 3B (3B - VW Passat B5 (1997 > 2005))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 19 35 36 37 46 47 55 56 57 58 75 76 77
         
 
VIN: WVWPD63B34P157036   Mileage: 303140km-188362miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: 06B-906-018-AWM.clb
   Part No SW: 4B0 906 018 DQ    HW: 8E0 909 018 A
   Component: 1.8L R4/5VT     G   0060  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: VWZ7Z0C8454940
   Coding: 0016551
   Shop #: WSC 01057 444 54395
   VCID: 73B0D6E7A7AF9372529-5160
   VINID: 9E69E05060D20C48011470031871EAF7BE

1 Fault Found:
17748 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40) / Engine Speed Sensor (G28) 
            P1340 - 001 - Incor. Correlation
Readiness: 0000 1100

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 01V-927-156.lbl
   Part No: 3B0 927 156 AM
   Component: AG5 01V 1.8l5VT USA 1212  
   Coding: 0001104
   Shop #: WSC 00028 028 00001
   VCID: 71BCDCEFDDB3A162A05-5160

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 8E0-614-111-ASR.lbl
   Part No: 3B0 614 111 
   Component: ABS/ASR 5.3 FRONT   D00  
   Coding: 00021
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 53F0766742EFF372B29-51CE

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 909 605 C
   Component: 09 AIRBAG VW61 04   0003  
   Coding: 12345
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 2412E5BB57C144CA1B3-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel        Labels: 1J0-907-487-A.lbl
   Part No: 1J0 907 487 A
   Component: Lenkradelektronik   0005  
   Coding: 00118
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 2F381A970E07F792F61-5160

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 3B0-920-xx5-17.lbl
   Part No: 3B0 920 929 B
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V04  
   Coding: 15235
   Shop #: WSC 88888  
   VCID: 2616FFB321FDB6DA057-513C
   WVWPD63B34P157036     VWZ7Z0C8454940

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.clb
   Part No: 6N0 909 901 
   Component: Gateway K<->CAN    0001  
   Coding: 00006
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 70BAD9EBD3B9A86AAFB-513C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 1C0-959-799.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 959 799 C
   Component: 08 Komfortgerát HLO 0003  
   Coding: 00258
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 372822F7F6573F52AE1-4B1E

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1C1959801
   Component: 08 Tõrsteuer.FS KLO 0202  

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 1C1959802
   Component: 08 Tõrsteuer.BF KLO 0202  

   Subsystem 3 - Part No: 1C0959811
   Component: 08 Tõrsteuer.HL KLO 0202  

   Subsystem 4 - Part No: 1C0959812
   Component: 08 Tõrsteuer.HR KLO 0202  

1 Fault Found:
00928 - Locking Module for Central Locking; Front Driver Side (F220) 
            27-10 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio        Labels: 3B7-035-1xx-56.lbl
   Part No: 3B7 035 180 G
   Component:    Radio NP2        0016  
   Coding: 04031
   Shop #: WSC 00028  
   VCID: 2412E5BB57C144CA1B3-513C

No fault code found.

End----------(Elapsed Time: 04:17, VBatt start/end: 12.6V/12.3V)-----------

Thoughts? I checked and re-checked mechanical timing multiple times. Should I replace the G28 sensor?

 

[duxdweller]

Bump. Anyone have experience with this? If you've timed these before you know that there's always a lingering doubt about the 16 rollers count etc. Marks on the valve cover and exhaust camshaft wheel line up at TDC (determined TDC with the screwdriver in the cylinder method). Assume also that if my cam timing on the intake side was off I'd be throwing the 16395 code, right?

 

[dareckim11]

1 Fault Found:

17748 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40) / Engine Speed Sensor (G28)

P1340 - 001 - Incor. Correlation

This error indicates that there is no synchronization between the camshaft and crankshaft sensors.

Assume also that if my cam timing on the intake side was off I'd be throwing the 16395 code, right?

No. because this engine has only one camshaft sensor and it is on the intake side.
So you definitely need to look into the chain.

 

[duxdweller]

This error indicates that there is no synchronization between the camshaft and crankshaft sensors.

No. because this engine has only one camshaft sensor and it is on the intake side.
So you definitely need to look into the chain.

Thank you for your help! My cam alignment looks correct to me. As it sits, the exhaust cam notch at TDC (measured both by the timing belt notch and a dowel in the #1 cylinder) directly aligns with the arrow on the cam guide. Counting 16 rollers over, the intake cam notch is at approx 1:00. As the CCT is new, I'm baffled as to how the timing could be off? I didn't replace the chain (read in many places that a stretch is highly unlikely?) Wouldn't I feel a loss of power on acceleration too if the mechanical timing was off? Thanks for your thoughts!!!

 

[dareckim11]

At first glance everything looks fine. The problem lies in the chain tensioner.

 

[duxdweller]

Chain tensioner is brand new - Gates brand (which is considered quite reliable). Could this possibly be related to oil pressure? I know some 1.8Ts have issued with clogged pickup screens? Would a clogged screen throw any other codes or warnings? I thought that usually the pickup screen issue resulted in oil starvation at HIGHER RPMs (my issue seems to be the opposite - runs fine above 1200)?

 

[dareckim11]

How to adjust the timing chain
Check the timing belt setting carefully. The marks on the crankshaft pulley and the camshaft pulley must match.
Then go to the chain and set it as in this picture. Yours is the first one from the top.
Pay attention to the teeth of the exhaust shaft, you start counting before the mark. You end counting on the intake shaft evenly on the mark. Or vice versa.

 

[duxdweller]

Hi all. Took everything apart again and reset the cam alignment. I believe I has 17 rollers rather than 16. Now it won't start at all! See my pics below. Can anyone tell me if I have this right?

https://imgur.com/a/MlKypxQ

https://imgur.com/a/Ny3NmbD

 

[duxdweller]

New CCT and CSS, Followed specs exactly. It ran with it off by one tooth (by my count it was 17 teeth - pretty sure this is now correct at 16 by my count.)

 

[Dr Sheldon]

New CCT and CSS, Followed specs exactly. It ran with it off by one tooth (by my count it was 17 teeth - pretty sure this is now correct at 16 by my count.)

The trick is to run it then scan it.

If it is in, it is in. If not you will get a fault code.

If you have 2 camshafts and one Cam sensor on the Inlet then you will not get a code if the Exhaust cam is out ?? Will just run shit !

 

[duxdweller]

The trick is to run it then scan it.

If it is in, it is in. If not you will get a fault code.

If you have 2 camshafts and one Cam sensor on the Inlet then you will not get a code if the Exhaust cam is out ?? Will just run shit !

Thanks Doc. Won't start at all now (so no scan available). Worked better when the timing was at 17 rollers. Looking for someone to confirm that my alignment is correct per the photo @dareckim11 sent from the manual. Take a look at my pics and let me know if you think I have it right. The exhaust cam is correct per the scoring on the head cover and the marks on the cranks (also had the timing belt done 10k ago by a reputable shop and ran great for the last 10k until the CCT went).

 

[Dr Sheldon]

Take a look at my pics and let me know if you think I have it right.

Really !!

This is not Painting by Numbers !!

FFS - Valve timing is a scary issue when stood with the car !! Certainly not getting involved in making judgements from pictures !!


If it helps, all i ever do is set the timing per instructions and double / triple check it before starting - Works for me every time ! Really dont see the struggle with it ?

Pressure transducer in the Plug hole on a scope would paint a pretty picture of what is what in there.

Won't start at all now (so no scan available)

Why not ??

Any codes stored as you crank it ?

 

[Dr Sheldon]

Marks on the valve cover and exhaust camshaft wheel line up at TDC (determined TDC with the screwdriver in the cylinder method).

What is the correct tool to lock the crank ??

A pin in the flywheel ??

Is this one of them where the pulley has no woodruff key ??

 

[vwtech]

The 16 links always look of a 1/2 tooth and is confusing for the first time.
But at one link off it should still start.
The cam gear on intake has a keyway so kind of hard to screw that up.
The cam shaft position sensor does have a piece of steel bolted on the exhaust camshaft that the sensor reads. It has a tab to locate it also make sure it's not bent. If you took it off.
If it is bent it breaks the sensor. I have done this myself by mistake.
I will send you a P.M. asking for a email address so read it and I will send you info on setting up chain.
Good Luck

 

[duxdweller]

Thanks for your help! Switched the cam shaft sensor to a bosch unit - now it starts up and runs fine! However - got one instance of the "16395 - Bank 1 Camshaft A (intake) P0411 -008 Retard setpoint not reached (over-advanced) - intermittent - MIL ON" in the first 10 miles. Cleared it and it hasn't come back (another 20 miles or so). New gem though - I got the "low oil pressure - STOP" message!! This came on randomly at a stop sign. Went away within two seconds and was fine for a while - but then came back on and off when I was going up my driveway. No codes. I changed the oil immediately after swapping the CCT - so I have the correct, clean, synthetic oil in it. Any thoughts?

 

[vwtech]

Oil issue that are common are pick up tube for oil pump in oil pan. A PITA in a Passat to drop the oil pan.
It is common on 1.8T for screen to clog.
I also sent email.
Good Luck

 

[EuroX]

I would not be surprised if the engine is sludged. As mentioned above drop the pan and clean or replace the pick up or check oil pressure prior to that if thats something you want to do. The pictures tell me everything the fact that the inside of the cylinder head is very dark in color tells me this vehicle did not have frequent oil changes at all. A vehicle that was well maintained with the proper oil will have a nice goldish color inside not varnish.

 

[duxdweller]

Thank you all! I don't have the facilities to drop the pan (given the subframe is in the way). Any idea what an indy would charge to do it? Ballpark?

 

[duxdweller]

Occurred to me that it's possible that pieces of the CCT rail ended up in the oil pan/screen. I cleaned up the head as best I could from up top - but who knows what made its way down. Also theorizing that it's possible that the intermittent low oil pressure warning (and condition) is causing the same intermittent 16395 code (CCT not fully actuating due to intermittent inadequate pressure)?

 

[EuroX]

Occurred to me that it's possible that pieces of the CCT rail ended up in the oil pan/screen. I cleaned up the head as best I could from up top - but who knows what made its way down. Also theorizing that it's possible that the intermittent low oil pressure warning (and condition) is causing the same intermittent 16395 code (CCT not fully actuating due to intermittent inadequate pressure)?

Very possible. This is often the case. Back in the day when I had such issues with b5 audi a4's when they had the same engine and I got random oil pressure codes usually a minute or 2 after getting off the highway in traffic and slower engine speeds or stand still i started using lucas heavy duty oil stabilizer and it resolved the issue. That product in engine honey but it did it's job. However the proper way would be to drop the pan. Depending where you're at in terms of cost to drop the pan I usually charge 5hours to such a job plus parts, and consumables. Most private shop in NJ are around 175$ an hour or so. So essentially you need to think that it would be around a grand out of the door ball park or just under.