2007 Caravelle 2.5 - Code Recognition & Constant Running Cooling Fan

[DrWood]

Hello all,

I'm looking for help decoding a scan of my neighbours motor. We've been hard at it replacing sensors and fault finding to try and stop a permanently running cooling fan (sounds like a harrier jet as soon as ignition comes on). We've replaced exhaust and DPF sensors, done a DPF regen through VCDS and now down to only the HVAC fault codes, apart from a single fault "zero" fault code on the (01) engine controller (posted below).

He had a guy out to do a DPF clean and he used an OBDII reader to try and force a regen, I'm thinking it might be something to do with that. Any help in deciphering the code etc would be greatly appreciated.

Plus any ideas what the constant running of the fan is all about would be nice to hear too. No fault codes related to it, it's had new relays, controllers and speed control resistor fitted as well as wiring checks to each sensor. As there aren't any engine cooling controller faults we're pretty much stumped. I did wonder if the HVAC pressure sensor fault could trigger the fan to spin up or if it might be as simple as a thermostat, but figured the best place to start would be here!

Thanks in advance for any assistance and/or ideas,

VCDS
Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: Release 24.5.0(x64) Data version: 20240429 DS355.0
www.Ross-Tech.com
Dealer/Shop Name:
Workshop Code: 000 00000 000000
Self-Diagnosis Log
Thursday,26,September,2024,16:47:50:56628
VIN: WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 License Plate: KEV CARAVELLE
Mileage: 231350km-143754mi Repair Order:
Chassis Type: 7H (7H - VW Transporter/Multivan (2003 > 2010))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 0B 0D 15 16 17 18 19 1C 22 2D 37 45 46 47 56
57 6E 76 77 78 7D
VIN: WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 Mileage: 231350km-143754miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: 070-906-016-BPC.clb
Part No SW: 070 997 016 L HW: 070 997 016 L
Component: R5 2,5L EDC G000SG 0858
Revision: --H05--- Serial number: VWZ7Z0F4809233
Coding: 0001072
Shop #: WSC 11111 551 00000
VCID: 2318817EA7C82B526A1-513C
VINID: 9E60AAAAA1D8A8760108020800D46736A1
1 Fault Found:
000000 - SAE - Reserved by Document ISO/SAE J2012-2018
P0000 - 000 - - Intermittent
Readiness: 0 0 0 0 1
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 7H0-907-37x-ESP.lbl
Part No SW: 7H0 907 379 R HW: 7H0 907 379 R
Component: ESP MK25E1 0104
Revision: 00H31001
Coding: 0000555
Shop #: WSC 02756 790 00000
VCID: 44DA22E242860C6A33B-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS
Self-Diagnosis Log
Thursday,26,September,2024,16:47:51:56628
Page 2
VIN: WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 License Plate: KEV CARAVELLE
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 7Hx-907-040.clb
Part No: 7H2 907 040 C
Component: CLIMAtronic T5 4221
Coding: 0011040
Shop #: WSC 02757 790 00000
VCID: 28029652DEEEC80A3F3-5118
Subsystem 1 - Part No: 7H5 907 049 D
Component: Display_2_ClimaT5 X 0307
2 Faults Found:
00819 - High Pressure Sensor (G65)
009 - Open or Short to Ground
01592 - Air Quality Sensor (G238)
007 - Short to Ground
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels:. 7H0-937-049.lbl
Part No: 7H0 937 049 T
Component: BORDNETZ SGVER 1.0 2001
Coding: 0000359
Shop #: WSC 02756 790 00000
VCID: 43D821FE47880B520A1-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 0D: Slide Door, Left Labels: Redir Fail!
Part No: 7H0 959 243 J
Component: Schiebetuer-SG 404 0320
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 392443163544418250D-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
Part No: 1C0 909 605 F
Component: 11 AIRBAG VW61 0R 0004
Coding: 12593
Shop #: WSC 02756
VCID: 2700956ED6F0C772369-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS
Self-Diagnosis Log
Thursday,26,September,2024,16:47:51:56628
Page 3
VIN: WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 License Plate: KEV CARAVELLE
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 7Hx-920-xxx-17.lbl
Part No: 7H5 920 973 J
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V02
Coding: 05413
Shop #: WSC 00046
VCID: 3C2A5A023F7674AA4BB-5118
WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 VWZ7Z0F4809233
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 18: Aux. Heat Labels: 7H0-819-008.clb
Part No: 7H0 815 071 G
Component: Standheizung 0210
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 2C0A6A42CA16E42ADBB-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.clb
Part No: 6N0 909 901
Component: Gateway K<->CAN 0001
Coding: 00006
Shop #: WSC 02756
VCID: 70B2BE3223BEC0CAA73-5118
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 45: Inter. Monitor Labels: 7Hx-951-171.lbl
Part No: 7H5 951 171 C
Component: Innenraumueberw. 2917
Coding: 0000012
Shop #: WSC 02757 790 00000
VCID: 2F307D4EFB009F32FE9-5184
Subsystem 1 - Part No: 7H5 951 178
Component: Innenraumueberw. 1607
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS
Self-Diagnosis Log
Thursday,26,September,2024,16:47:51:56628
Page 4
VIN: WV2ZZZ7HZ7H120880 License Plate: KEV CARAVELLE
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 7H0-959-433.lbl
Part No: 7H0 959 433
Component: Komfortgerát 0003
Coding: 00025
Shop #: WSC 00053
VCID: 70B2BE3223BEC0CAA73-4AE0
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist Labels: 7E0-919-283.lbl
Part No: 7E0 919 283
Component: Parkingsyst. T5 T5M 801
Coding: 10127
Shop #: WSC 02756
VCID: 6C8AAA420F96242A9BB-513C
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 78: Slide Door, Right Labels: Redir Fail!
Part No: 7H0 959 243 J
Component: Schiebetuer-SG 404 0320
Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
VCID: 392443163544418250D-5118
No fault code found.
End----(Elapsed Time: 05:55, VBatt start/end: 11.6V/11.5V. VIgn 11.5V)-----
	
	



	
	

		

	

 

[davisev5225]

it's had new relays, controllers and speed control resistor fitted as well as wiring checks to each sensor

Is this the secondary cooling fan mounted on/near the radiator/condenser, or is this the blower motor for the cabin air? If it's not the blower motor, then the HVAC speed resistor doesn't matter.

When you say you replaced controllers, did you replace the electric cooling fan controller in the engine bay? If so, did you order the correct matching part number? Where did the part come from and what brand is it? A cooling fan running full blast at all times when ignition is powered on sounds like a burned out fan controller.

 

[Jef]

Coolant fans are run by a fan control module (J293). In short, when the J293 gets an ignition signal and wakes up, it expects to get a data signal from the ECM for what the fans should be doing. If the J293 doesn't get that signal, they the fans will default to high speed when the ignition is turned on.

Please double check the ECM DTCs. And then unplug the J293 and see if you get a new DTC in the ECM.

 

[Dr Sheldon]

Hello all,
it's had new relays, controllers and speed control resistor fitted as well

Put all the original parts back on - It is logical to do so !!

 

[DrWood]

Is this the secondary cooling fan mounted on/near the radiator/condenser, or is this the blower motor for the cabin air? If it's not the blower motor, then the HVAC speed resistor doesn't matter.

When you say you replaced controllers, did you replace the electric cooling fan controller in the engine bay? If so, did you order the correct matching part number? Where did the part come from and what brand is it? A cooling fan running full blast at all times when ignition is powered on sounds like a burned out fan controller.

Thanks for getting back to me, it's the main cooling fan not the blower motor.

I wondered if it was connected to the fault on the AC pressure sensor, thinking that as there is no read on the pressure the system automatically just switches the fans on to cool the system thus ensuring pressure doesn't increase too much because of heat by pulling the air over the AC condenser which is obviously in the same area as the engine rad.

Pretty sure the relay unit that was changed was the J293, I could be wrong but it looks like what I remember. Firstly a used unit was swapped out then a brand new one from VW.

 

[DrWood]

Coolant fans are run by a fan control module (J293). In short, when the J293 gets an ignition signal and wakes up, it expects to get a data signal from the ECM for what the fans should be doing. If the J293 doesn't get that signal, they the fans will default to high speed when the ignition is turned on.

Please double check the ECM DTCs. And then unplug the J293 and see if you get a new DTC in the ECM.

Thanks for your reply,

I'm a bit new to VCDS, just working bits out as I need to. There are no DTC's showing for that controller, do I need to open something up via VCDS to get a proper view of controller settings/DTCs?

 

[Jef]

Ignition on, plugged up to car, start up VCDS
[Select]
[01-Engine]
[Fault Codes - 02]

Does that show you any fault codes?
Then exit out, ignition off, unplug J293 and go back and check for fault codes.

Right now, I suspect you have a failed J293, but not enough data to really verify that as possible.... just a "hunch" I have based on J293s failing here and there.

 

[DrWood]

Ignition on, plugged up to car, start up VCDS
[Select]
[01-Engine]
[Fault Codes - 02]

Does that show you any fault codes?
Then exit out, ignition off, unplug J293 and go back and check for fault codes.

Right now, I suspect you have a failed J293, but not enough data to really verify that as possible.... just a "hunch" I have based on J293s failing here and there.

Certainly seems that way, will have a go at that.

I've read elsewhere, about faulty coolant temp sensors causing the issue too. That seems entirely plausible to me as well, if it's functioning but just sending the wrong reading then I suppose it's possible it could not be causing a fault code (in that it's working because it sends a signal to cause the fan to come on as it should but just thinks it's always really hit).

 

[Jef]

With a dead cold engine, go to 01-08-001.4. You should get a reading that is more or less whatever the ambient temperature is. And then when you start up the engine and run it, should see the temp gradually go up as the engine warms up. If you have a pyrometer, then see what is says the temp sensor is and that the live data more or less agrees (don't expect a direct match).

 

[DrWood]

With a dead cold engine, go to 01-08-001.4. You should get a reading that is more or less whatever the ambient temperature is. And then when you start up the engine and run it, should see the temp gradually go up as the engine warms up. If you have a pyrometer, then see what is says the temp sensor is and that the live data more or less agrees (don't expect a direct match).

Didn't have a pyrometer to hand but opened up the controller (thanks for the pointer to the instructions by the way), it was reading 47 degrees at the time we put it one which felt about right and certainly not a level I'd expect the cooling fans kick in.

Checked wiring from the fan control relay module to the fan and it is good, the control module is the correct part number and was brand new. So I believe the temp is reading correctly and the control module being new should be free of fault, no codes showing for either (are there any VCDS tests I can do on the control module?).
My logic in trying to diagnose:

The HVAC faults could be causing the issue but it could be 2 separate issues
To understand that we have to fix the HVAC
If it is the HVAC then after that gets fixed we have found the problem.
If it isn't then the only component not taken out and checked is the fan unit itself (but I struggle to see any logic that means it could be that as it gets power from the fan control module).

So the HVAC issues (no AC at the moment):

G65 (high pressure) sensor open or short to ground
G238 (air quality) sensor short to ground

Replaced G65 with a brand new OEM unit, same fault thrown. Checked fuses in centre dash, all in decent shape. My following logic (assuming the sensor is good):

Either the wiring is bad or the control module is not functioning correctly
Before replacing the G238 sensor we must check the wiring from the sensors to the control module and to the fuse board
If the wiring is in good shape the climate control becomes chief suspect and needs to be tested.

My question here; does the Climatronic display and control unit in the cabin include the electronic control module for the system or is that a separate controller (I know that my Phaeton has a separate control module located in the dash whilst the display and controls are in a separate unit)?

Is it possible that faults for the sensors and not the controller might be caused by a faulty controller (not sure how to say other than in the simplest terms that the controller thinks it's working but actually it's confused and not understanding the signals from the sensors)?

 

[Jef]

HVAC controls are a single unit.... 7H2 907 040 C

The G65, unplug it and see if you can light up a test light across terminals /1 and /3.

/2 of the G65 goes to the HVAC control head, T16b/4

Yes, it is possible this is a bad HVAC control head, but that isn't a common issue that I'm aware of.... G65 bad, fuse, or damn rodents eating wiring are the more common things I've come across.