Automotive locksmithing

   #1  

darksim905

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I know this thread may not get too many replies as to the nature of the subject, but can someone tell me roughly what the deal is regarding reprogramming keys on newer VAG cars? My understanding is, your average locksmith or average joe can't do it these days due to not being able to grab the SKC/pin with specific tools. I won't mention the names of the tools outright as I don't know if that's against the rules or not, but a few automotive locksmiths were telling me newer cars don't allow you to program keys yourself and/or program it with their tools, forcing you to do go directly to the dealer. Why is that? Does it have anything to do with various sorts of thefts that happen outside of the United States? Or is it just so the dealerships aren't losing a way to make money? :confused:
 
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Uwe

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On most newer VW/Audi cars (roughly 2007, but it varies), a PIN code is not sufficient to program keys; things are a lot more complicated than that.

An independent shop can register as a "Vehicle Security Professional" through the NASTF, see here. Once that's done, for 2010 and newer models, the independent shop can use a "generic" J2534 tool (a good one costs ~$1500) with VW's own ODIS software and on-line GeKo access to program keys (of course subscriptions to these services are also far from cheap) but I believe the keys must still be ordered by VIN as well.

There are some people here who are more familiar with this than I am. Hopefully some of them will chime in.

-Uwe-
 
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darksim905

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Thanks for the reply Mr. Uwe -- the work you & the rest of Ross-Tech do is amazing. I didn't think dealers would allow you to do key adaptation with a standard j2534 tool but I keep forgetting there are a lot of locksmith specific add-ons and/or versions of software out there. Regarding 2007+ vehicles is that because of transitioning to Immo 2 to Immo 3 or is it internal things like GeKo & transponders they use in their keys e.g. Megamos, etc? I guess I have a lot of reading/learning to do. If anyone happens to see this, I'd love PMs with dedicated material or guidance on automotive locksmithing.

As a quick aside, is there anything I need to know if I'm going to download/try out ODIS with the VCDS cable? Everything I'm seeing shows that ODIS is at 2.0.2.
 
   #4  

Jack@European_Parts

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http://forums.ross-tech.com/showthr...-recalls-discuss&p=42120&viewfull=1#post42120

https://www.erwin.vw.com/erwin/showKeycodeInstructions.do


[h=1]Keycode Instructions[/h]

[h=2]Independent Workshop Procedure for Obtaining Replacement Keys and Key adaptions and Key codes[/h][h=3]Access to vehicle security information and replacement keys is provided for security professionals registered with the NASTF (National Auto Service Task Force) vehicle security professional registry. (LSID) For more information visit the NASTF Web Site. www.nastf.org[/h][h=3]For Canada (Vehicle Security Professional program) (VSP)
www.vehiclesecurityprofessional.ca[/h]The Immobilizer is a theft-deterrent device that adds a layer of security that is standard on every Volkswagen and Audi model. This is achieved with an electronic device embedded in the ignition key, an Immobilizer Control Module and an electronic link to the Engine Control Module.

[h=2]System Access[/h]Volkswagen uses an on-line Immobilizer Adaptation (PIN) delivery system. It is a vehicle anti-theft protection system. With this system a VAS 6150C or 6160 diagnostic tool equipped with “ODIS Service” software is connected to the vehicle and via Internet to an online database called Fazit. The identification of the tester and vehicle are passed to the database and the correct PIN is passed to the vehicle in a secure link without direct user interface.

[h=2]Internet Requirements for performing Key adaptations[/h][h=3]This technique requires a secure un-interrupted Internet connection[/h][h=3]How high is the volume of data transmitted during immobilizer adaptation?[/h]During update programming approx. 4MB are transmitted via the Internet connection.
A special certificate is required.
[h=3]Why do I need a permanent Internet link for update programming?[/h]In order to avoid errors occurring during the immobilizer process it is important to understand that once started, the process can not be interrupted.


[h=3]First Step: Registration[/h]You must be a registered with the NASTF (National Auto Service Task Force) vehicle security professional registry (LSID) and a current Registered VW / Audi workshop to obtain keys and key adaptations. Please visit the NASTF Registry to complete the registration process. www.nastf.org
Canadian applicants must be registered with the Vehicle Security Professional (VSP) program in Canada at www.vehiclesecurityprofessional.ca or call at 1(866) 309-4272

[h=3]Second Step: Register as an Authorized Independent Workshop with VW[/h]Independent workshops wishing to obtain Keys and adaptations must first be registered with VW.
Process: 1. Program registration forms and security ID applications are available for direct download from our Erwin web site: https://erwin.vw.com or https://erwin.audiusa.com
See “Vehicle Diagnostics” on the Erwin Home page.

Fill out the forms and fax them to the fax number provided on the forms or e-mail them to techinfo@vw.com or techinfo@audi.com
2. The workshop must return the completed forms, along with business license documentation to VW or Audi Key Help. VW Key Help will respond to the workshop with a confirmation of receipt within 2 days upon receipt of the application. Total processing time from initial request to approval or disapproval will take approximately 2-3 Weeks, plus time spent by the requesting workshop during the application cycle.
3. Individual Security System access IDs and passwords will be sent via separate e-mail for security


[h=3]Third Step: Obtaining as VAS 6150C / 6160 diagnostic tool and ODIS Service software[/h]To obtain ODIS Service software see “Vehicle Diagnostics” on the Erwin Home page.

All Volkswagen / Audi Special Tools and Workshop Equipment are available for purchase to residents of the US and Canada through Snap-on Business Solutions, a division of Snap-on Tools.

Access to the tool catalogs can be obtained at:
http://.vw.snapon.com and http://audi.snapon.com
Please contact them directly.
Toll-free in the US and Canada: (800) 892-9650
From outside the US and Canada: (262) 656-5200
E-Mail To: vwaudi@snapon.com

[h=3]Fourth Step: Obtaining a Key or a Key Adaptation[/h]Obtaining an immobilizer adaptation requires Vas 6150/6160 or laptop configured with ODIS Service for use with the security system, a high speed internet connection and additional information identifying both the vehicle and workshop to maintain security. The adaptation is only valid for the vehicle it is being performed on at the time it is being performed.
1. Registered workshops with a Locksmith ID Number (LSID) or VSP number for Canadian applicants: order a Key or request a key Adaptation through the Audi or VW Key Service Web Sites www.keys-audi.com or www.keys-vw.com
2. A security certificate is activated allowing timed access to the secure web site for adaptation.


  • If the vehicle has been reported as stolen, no immobilizer adaptation will be given.
  • A service fee will apply for each key ordered or adaptation received by the workshop.
  • The cost of the key will also be charged to the registered workshop
  • Registered workshops will submit an on line credit card payment to receive each adaptation.
For questions or concerns contact VW Key Help at (866) 327-1904 or Audi Key Help at (866) 327-1906 or e-mail at custserve@keys-vw.com or custserve@keys-audi.com

https://www.erwin.vw.com/erwin/showKeycodeFaq.do


[h=1]Key Code FAQs[/h]
[h=2]Concerns[/h]

[h=2]Answers[/h][h=3]I recently submitted an application for the VW locksmith program. Does this cover both VW and Audi or do I submit a separate application for the Audi program?[/h]You only need to apply once. Audi is included.
[h=3]I'm working at a locksmith company that registered in NASTF and need key codes. I need help. My registration was not successful.[/h]If you go to the home page and look at the instructions under (Security Professionals) on the home page. That should have all the information you need to get started. You are actually ahead since you already have your LSID.
[h=3]All of the 2009 VW US models should be adaptable for immobilizer. The Audi models started in 2010.[/h]All of the 2009 VW US models should be adaptable for immobilizer. The Audi models started in 2010.
[h=3]Need to know if you need a copy of our business license or are we able to purchase keys at this time?[/h]Are you a registered Security Professional? Please read the instructions under security professionals on the Erwin Home page.
[h=3]I need help to program a key.[/h]Are you a registered Security Professional? Please read the instructions under security professionals on the Erwin Home page.
 
   #5  

Uwe

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Regarding 2007+ vehicles is that because of transitioning to Immo 2 to Immo 3.
No, it's the transition from Immo 3/4a to 4c. See here.

As a quick aside, is there anything I need to know if I'm going to download/try out ODIS with the VCDS cable?
ODIS will not run through a VCDS cable.

-Uwe-
 
   #6  

JacobHawkins

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I nearly misplaced my Rx8 key and nearly had a heart attack after thinking im going to cough up 400$+ to the Mazda dealer for a replacement + 200$ towing fees for platform over 100 miles - as we all know you cant lift and tow an rx8 due to its Diff)

I have a few cars and bikes, all second hand with one key. I asked around and 1 key is about 150$+ in my area. Does anybody have any experience with purchasing an automotive key duplicator off ALiexpress or E-bay which actually works?
 
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