Control Circuit for Intake Air Regulating Flap - P10A0 - Electrical Malfunction

   #21  

vapor.rob

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Alright! So after the dealership being a total waste and telling me what I already know, these are the results.

As posted on the scan, my vehicle has a CTHD ECU.
With only 65,000KM, and all harness and connectors intact I was pretty sure that the wiring was not an issue.

My fault was the P10A0 - Electrical Malfunction on the Air Recirculating Flap.

My issue was the ECU. There are two options to get this sorted.

1. Have the ECU replaced with one with the EXACT part number printed on it. Ending letters MUST be the same and have it coded to the car. The shop or person must have VW dealer tool to properly have this done, however the issue will return as this is a known fault for these vehicles in this climate.

Or

2. Repair the ECU. I had no choice but to go with this option as I was unable to locate my ECU online or locally, and also, the option of brand new was costing over 3000USD which was not feasible for me.

Repairing the problem:

From looking on, apparently there’s a capacitor that burns for whatever reason due to the circulation flap as it’s connected directly to the ECU. So that was replaced and the track from the pin for the circulation flap to the capacitor was also burnt. It was damaged pretty badly. So that was repaired. After this, I cleared the fault, and I can now go over 3000rpm.

So this is the solution. Once your connector to the flap is in good condition, and you changed the flap but the P10A0 fault is still there, it’s the ECU.

Hope this helps someone in the future.
 
   #22  

Uwe

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Repair the ECU. I had no choice but to go with this option as I was unable to locate my ECU online or locally, and also, the option of brand new was costing over 3000USD which was not feasible for me.
$3000 for an ECU from the dealer is highway robbery.

But FYI, in case repair isn't feasible: Someone with the right tools can reflash an ECU that's "close" (same HW p/n, in your case 03C-907-309-Q) with the correct software for your engine, and also copy the immo data from your old ECU to a such a replacement.

-Uwe-
 
   #23  

vapor.rob

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$3000 for an ECU from the dealer is highway robbery.
Absolutely, it was totally ridiculous, I preferred going the non repair route but it was difficult to find someone who would firstly ship the ECU to a location I can get it to me, and others didn’t have the correct part number. The coding was also quite costly here as well, so I’ve decided just to get it repaired which cost me about $250USD.

The cheapest I was able to get the ECU was $3000USD with shipping and this was an independent dealer. The Dealer here in Trinidad wanted over $5300USD for the ECU and an addition $2000USD for the coding.

A car that now has a resale value of $10,000USD, I think I would pass. But thankfully the repair has been working well since, no issues.

But nevertheless, thanks for the help guys!
 
   #24  

vwtech

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Damn that hurts.

Good Luck
 
   #25  

Dr Sheldon

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So this is the solution....................... , and you changed the flap but the P10A0 fault is still there, it’s the ECU.

Well that isn't quite true is it ? In fact it is bad advice !! The worst kind !!

The correct procedure is to test and confirm the Flap and the Wiring (as you did) then look at condemning the ECU.

That would need a scope, decade box a pwm emulator if it is not Linbus.





I'm very pedantic with these things !!
 
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   #26  

Apendiixator

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Absolutely, it was totally ridiculous, I preferred going the non repair route but it was difficult to find someone who would firstly ship the ECU to a location I can get it to me, and others didn’t have the correct part number. The coding was also quite costly here as well, so I’ve decided just to get it repaired which cost me about $250USD.

The cheapest I was able to get the ECU was $3000USD with shipping and this was an independent dealer. The Dealer here in Trinidad wanted over $5300USD for the ECU and an addition $2000USD for the coding.

A car that now has a resale value of $10,000USD, I think I would pass. But thankfully the repair has been working well since, no issues.

But nevertheless, thanks for the help guys!
To Vapor: Are you absolutely sure that the repair shop only changed your ECU? from my own experience of the same diagnostic record, I solved the problem by replacing the part V157. The joke is that these TSI engines have two flaps. But take everything into account that the text of the error usually does not specify whether it is a V157 or J338 part. If you can, please let me know if you changed the flap during your repair phase, which is mostly metal and is mounted very close to the rear wall of the body(J338).
 
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   #27  

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To Vapor: Are you absolutely sure that the repair shop only changed your ECU? from my own experience of the same diagnostic record, I solved the problem by replacing the part V157. The joke is that these TSI engines have two flaps. But take everything into account that the text of the error usually does not specify whether it is a V157 or G332 part. If you can, please let me know if you changed the flap during your repair phase, which is mostly metal and is mounted very close to the rear wall of the body.
Interesting.
 
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Thank you for the response Euro X. It is different with the marking of flaps in the schematics. (e.g. J338 vs V380). That's why I'm editing the information in the previous post. However, the basic thinking remains: TSI engines with double turbocharging have two flaps, but the VCDS error codes do not distinguish between them. A possible idea for the development of VCDS how to deal with this mystery :-) Unfortunately, I believe that even ODIS currently cannot accurately point to a specific one of the two flaps. I collect error code information from individual repairs in my database and try to find a connection in them. Unfortunately, these codes are completely different on the various TSI codes and I don't see even a hint of commonality in them.

See picture:

Any idea Uwe?
 
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   #29  

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the VCDS error codes do not distinguish between them. A possible idea for the development of VCDS how to deal with this mystery :-) Unfortunately, I believe that even ODIS currently cannot accurately point to a specific one of the two flaps.
That is because the control module that sets the codes does not differentiate between the two flaps. VCDS and ODIS see the same information and have no further information by which to differentiate.

The Control module is where the action is. ODIS and VCDS are tools that listen to and command the control module. They cannot change the response from the control module.

I hope that helps your understanding.
 
   #30  

Apendiixator

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Thank you for your contribution. So I have no doubt that the diagnostic tool cannot change the response. the digital code is of course determined by the unit. More precisely, it is determined by the SW units in the vehicle. But the unit in the vehicle cannot determine the text of the error. And that's what I meant. So if Odis throws an error, for example:
002909 - Intake air control flap drive P10A0 00 [101] - electrical fault

Why couldn't VCDS specify it for example as?: 002909 - Intake air control "B" flap drive P10A0 00 [101] - electrical fault.

We are only talking about text.
 
   #31  

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Why couldn't VCDS specify it for example as?: 002909 - Intake air control "B" flap drive P10A0 00 [101] - electrical fault.
On what basis is VCDS supposed to determine that it's the "B" flap if that information is not found on the fault code text in ODIS?

-Uwe-
 
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Friends, I am repeating what I wrote. The diagnosed control unit determines the fault code (i.e. the numbers, or a number with two letters), but not the text. The fault text is determined by the software of the diagnostic tool. If it's the way I write it here, I'm not going to "spin the globe" anymore. If not, please correct me and I will learn something new today. Thank you
 
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The diagnosed control unit determines the fault code (i.e. the numbers, or a number with two letters), but not the text.
The text cannot add information that is not supplied by the module, if the module supplies the same code for 2 different possible causes then the text cannot say the cause is source 1 when the only information available to generate the text says it could be source 1 or 2.
 
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   #37  

Apendiixator

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No one in this thread has claimed that the module provides the same code for two different reasons. But I claim that the text on the flap defect is insufficiently described. And I'm trying to find information on how the text can get into VCDS. As you can read at the beginning of this thread, this lack of information leads to the fact that the repairman (and not only him) is convinced that there is only one throttle valve on the car and subsequently changes the engine control unit.
 
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PetrolDave

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No one in this thread has claimed that the module provides the same code for two different reasons. But I claim that the text on the flap defect is insufficiently described. And I'm trying to find information on how the text can get into VCDS. As you can read at the beginning of this thread, this lack of information leads to the fact that the repairman (and not only him) is convinced that there is only one throttle valve on the car and subsequently changes the engine control unit.
Your discussion should be with the software engineers at VW not the guys at Ross-Tech who can only deal with the diagnostic information presented to them by the VW firmware.
 
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Dr Sheldon

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leads to the fact that the repairman (and not only him) is convinced that there is only one throttle valve on the car and subsequently changes the engine control unit.

You have no clue about the technology and the theory of the technology within it !!

I am that Repairman

and subsequently changes the engine control unit.
Not me !! I get it right all time !!

Add to that I enter National Competitions for Automotive Diagnostic Technicians and do well !!

Be Honest !! You do not have the Tooling and / or the Knowledge to complete this task regardless of the help thrown at you !!


I can solve that fault with a basic code reader, far short of VCDS, Yet you have VCDS and the support forum and you still here whinging an whining !

To be a Technician, any where near me, you need integrity First and the simple thing of reading the fault code !! Not blame every one but your self - Self Esteem my friend !!

Control Circuit for Intake Air Regulating Flap P10A0 00 [00100111] - Electrical Malfunction
FFS it is a metal disc and a dc motor !! that opens and closes it - It is a tap !! that is it !!

You need a professional scope to diagnose that !! Do you have the minerals for that !!
 
   #40  

Uwe

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he diagnosed control unit determines the fault code (i.e. the numbers, or a number with two letters), but not the text.
Correct.
The fault text is determined by the software of the diagnostic tool.
Also correct. But if the text on the original, factory scan tool does not specify "A" or "B" (and it does not!), the implication is that the same fault code number, sent by the control module, could be used for either one, and I believe it would a mistake for VCDS to ASS-U-ME that that P10A0 always means Flap "B".

-Uwe-
 
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