Passat B7 4motion - whining noise on deceleration

   #1  

Minikeum

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VCDS Serial number
C?ID=396805
Hello all,

I own a 2011 European VW Passat B7 Variant VR6 DSG 4motion. I believe this car is closer to a VW CC VR6 4motion than an american Passat B7, but I could be wrong.

The car just exceeded 100 000 mi.
The car is not modded ; everything is OEM as far as I know. I don't know about the previous owner, but I have never tracked that car, and I don't drive it hard.

My problem is that I can hear, in some specific conditions, a whining noise from the rear of the car, during deceleration.

Symptoms and other info:
- The noise is wheel speed related, not engine rpm related,
- The noise appears only on deceleration, as soon as I touch the throttle the noise disappears,
- The noise is mostly heard above 80 km/h (50mph), and the volume subjectively increases when decelerating from higher speeds,
- The noise is gone when I shift to neutral,
- Reving the engine while decelerating with DSG in neutral does not trigger the noise,
- The noise appears only on hot days and after driving for a bit,
- I don't believe the noise pitch or volume change when braking or turning,
- No strange noise on the parking in tight turns, beside tire squeaking a little bit on hot tarmac,
- According to the car service manual, DSG6 oil and filters, as well as haldex (gen 4) oil were changed at 73400mi, in May 2018. No mention of Haldex filter change (apparently VW never mention a filter in the haldex service manual? But this filter does exist and can be replaced),
- According to the car service manual, the rear diff oil was changed at 91550mi, in July 2019,
- Both were performed by an official VAG specialist,
- I currently run 4 brand new summer tires (with just slightly more than 1500mi). Tire pressures are according to VW specs,
- Rear brake pads were changed at the same time as the tires,
- I removed the haldex unit fuse 3 weeks ago (hoping that the rear wheels would not engage at all?), but the noise remained,
- I also tried recently to get the haldex to engage by accelerating hard on wet road or loose surfaces. No codes were raised after these trials so I imagine the haldex is not broken.


My thoughts:
- Based on these observations, I suspect a rear diff issue,
- I don't think it is tire related because they are new (negligeable difference between front and rear tire wear), and the noise only appears when the weather is hot.
- I don't think it is wheel bearing related because the noise is gone on acceleration, or with DSG in neutral.
- I don't think it is rear pads related either, as braking don't change the noise,
- Also the fact that the rear diff oil was changed a few months before the previous owner sold the car is odd (I don't think the service manual ever require to change the rear diff oil ?).

What do you think ?


I have googled the symptoms quite a lot. I did find other VW/Audi owners with similar symptoms, but most of the time they either never fix the problem (or don't report back), or they end up getting the Haldex + rear diff replaced under warranty. Which is out of question for me.
Also I paid the car $12500, I'm not going to shelve $3000 on a used rear diff...

On this forum one guy sent a Golf IV R32 noisy rear diff to Gary Peloquin (well-known guy apparently?) who said that the pinion shaft was failing due to "oil starvation".
As often, it doesn't go much farther than that i.e. no fix or tricks to reduce/remove noise.


Any suggestion ?


Below is the Autoscan, although no code related to transmission or AWD were raised.

Code:
Monday,03,August,2020,21:36:00:21796
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 7 x64
VCDS Version: 20.4.1.0 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4508.4
Data version: 20200331 DS317.0
www.Ross-Tech.com


VIN: WVWZZZ3CZBE353067   License Plate: 
Mileage: 161510km-100357mi   Repair Order: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 3C-VW46 (7N0)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 10 13 14 15 16 17 19 22 25 2E 36 37 42 44 46
          47 4F 52 53 55 56 61 62 65 69 6C 6D 72 77

VIN: WVWZZZ3CZBE353067   Mileage: 161510km-100357miles

01-Engine -- Status: OK 0000
02-Auto Trans -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: OK 0000
04-Steering Angle -- Status: OK 0000
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: OK 0000
10-Park/Steer Assist -- Status: OK 0000
13-Auto Dist. Reg -- Status: Malfunction 0010
14-Susp. Elect. -- Status: OK 0000
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
16-Steering wheel -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: OK 0000
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: Malfunction 0010
22-AWD -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
2E-Media Player 3 -- Status: OK 0000
36-Seat Mem. Drvr -- Status: OK 0000
37-Navigation -- Status: Malfunction 0010
42-Door Elect, Driver -- Status: OK 0000
44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000
46-Central Conv. -- Status: OK 0000
47-Sound System -- Status: OK 0000
4F-Centr. Electr. II -- Status: OK 0000
52-Door Elect, Pass. -- Status: OK 0000
53-Parking Brake -- Status: OK 0000
55-Headlight Range -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: Malfunction 0010
61-Battery Regul. -- Status: OK 0000
62-Door, Rear Left -- Status: OK 0000
65-Tire Pressure -- Status: OK 0000
69-Trailer -- Status: OK 0000
6C-Back-up Cam. -- Status: OK 0000
6D-Trunk Elect. -- Status: OK 0000
72-Door, Rear Right -- Status: OK 0000
77-Telephone -- Status: Sporadic communication error 1000
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine (0-32-BWS_)       Labels:. 03H-907-309-V1.clb
   Part No SW: 03H 906 023 L    HW: 03H 907 309 A
   Component: 3,6 FSI EU5   H03 1024  
   Revision: MFH03---    Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 001D0012246600000000
   Shop #: WSC 00015 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_ECM36FSI01103H906023L 002007
   ROD: EV_ECM36FSI01103H906023L.rod
   VCID: 2B02FD0003806213D69-807E

No fault code found.
Readiness: 0000 0000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 02E-927-770.clb
   Part No SW: 02E 300 013 A    HW: 02E 927 770 AL
   Component: GSG DSG AG6     511 2606  
   Revision: 05351112    Serial number: 00001012271003
   Coding: 0000020
   Shop #: WSC 44551 111 44551
   VCID: 0F7A49909B583E33DA1-805A

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 3AA-614-109.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 614 109 P    HW: 3AA 614 109 P
   Component: J104   C2 450M V58F 0011  
   Revision: --H07---    Serial number: 00000003379620
   Coding: 0115108
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 3A2CC844F05ACB9B5DF-806E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC (J255)       Labels:| 5K0-907-044.clb
   Part No SW: 5K0 907 044 EA    HW: 5K0 907 044 EA
   Component: Climatronic   H17 1010  
   Revision: 00003001    
   Coding: 0000000002
   Shop #: WSC 00015 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Climatronic A01010
   ROD: EV_ClimaAutoBasis_VW46.rod
   VCID: 6E843414F012573BB17-803A

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. (J519)       Labels:. 3AA-937-087.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 937 087 B    HW: 3AA 937 087 B
   Component: BCM PQ47 H+   413 0452  
   Revision: BC413001    
   Coding: 0000000000000000001C0280740029F463D50088676D8D60E48046240041
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 392ED748F95CC083545-806C

   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3AB 955 419     HW: 3AB 955 419   Labels: 1KX-955-119.CLB
   Component: Wischer 17011  10  0603 
   Coding: 00B795

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 1K0 955 559 AH  Labels: 1K0-955-559-AG.CLB
   Component: RLS 110211 05  54  0403 
   Coding: 035028

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 10: Park/Steer Assist (J791)       Labels:| 3AA-919-475.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 919 475 D    HW: 3AA 919 475 A
   Component: PARKHILFE PLA H04 0007  
   Revision: --------    Serial number: 20431101802353
   Coding: 318106
   Shop #: WSC 99999 1023 2097151
   ASAM Dataset: EV_EPHVA2C000000000 001006
   ROD: EV_EPHVA2C000000000_001_VW36.rod
   VCID: 3C20CE5CF6EEF5AB4F3-8068

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 13: Auto Dist. Reg        Labels: 3AA-907-567.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 907 567     HW: 3AA 907 567 
   Component: AC201  RDW A    031 0143  
   Revision: 00031000    Serial number: 00000000086318
   Coding: 0010000
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 77AA117083C816F3621-8022

1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+ 
            002 - Lower Limit Exceeded - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00100010
                    Fault Priority: 3
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 255
                    Time Indication: 0

             Freeze Frame:
                    Count: 94


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 14: Susp. Elect. (J250)       Labels:. 3C0-907-376.clb
   Part No SW: 3C0 907 376 A    HW: 3C0 907 376 
   Component: DAEMPFUNGS-SG H07 0071  
   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 02021104130002
   Coding: 030180
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 270A01301FE84673321-8072

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 5N0-959-655.lbl
   Part No SW: 5N0 959 655 Q    HW: 5N0 959 655 Q
   Component: J234__10K VW10 HI   1918  
   Revision: 22014000    Serial number: 003JZP1YET4Z  
   Coding: 0012363
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 00000
   VCID: 4BC29D80AFC04213F69-801E

   Subsystem 1 - Serial number: 6332MTS628970111 

   Subsystem 2 - Serial number: 6342MTS621220111 

   Subsystem 3 - Serial number: 6351HTS64EV6M9KR 

   Subsystem 4 - Serial number: 6361HTS6Q6USM9KJ 

   Subsystem 5 - Serial number: 00000000000000000

   Subsystem 6 - Serial number: 00000000000000000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel (J527)       Labels:| 3C0-953-569.clb
   Part No SW: 3C9 953 501 BM    HW: 5K0 953 569 T
   Component: LENKS.MODUL   014 0140  
   Revision: FF010040    Serial number: 20110204301677
   Coding: 399AA50001
   Shop #: WSC 00015 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_VW360SteerWheelUDS A03004
   ROD: EV_VW360SteerWheelUDS.rod
   VCID: 75B61B78954464E370D-8020

   Multifunction steering wheel control module: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3C8 959 537 D    HW: 3C8 959 537 D  Labels: 3C8-959-537.CLB
   Component: E221__MFL-TK6  H06 0022 
   Coding: E30000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments (J285)       Labels:| 3C8-920-xxx-17.clb-SRI1
   Part No SW: 3AA 920 880     HW: 3AA 920 880 
   Component: KOMBI         H02 0206  
   Serial number: 00000000000000
   Coding: 161F01
   Shop #: WSC 05311 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09 A04089
   ROD: EV_Kombi_UDS_VDD_RM09_004_VW46.rod
   VCID: 70B82A6CEA2641CBA3B-8024

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway (J533)       Labels:. 7N0-907-530-V2.clb
   Part No SW: 7N0 907 530 G    HW: 1K0 907 951 
   Component: J533  Gateway H41 1614  
   Revision:   H41       Serial number: 100211F1001155
   Coding: 462006
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 3430E67CDE3E3DEB873-8060

1 Fault Found:
01303 - Telephone Transceiver (R36) 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00110100
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 179
                    Mileage: 160847 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.12.12
                    Time: 20:49:20


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 22: AWD        Labels: 0AY-907-554-V1.clb
   Part No SW: 0BS 907 554 B    HW: 0BS 907 554 B
   Component: Haldex 4Motion      4015  
   Coding: 0000005
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 45D6ABB889A4B46320D-8010

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 25: Immobilizer        Labels: 3C0-959-433-25.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 959 799     HW: 3AA 959 799 
   Component:    IMMO         083 0399  
   Revision: 00083000    Serial number: VWZCZ000000000
   Shop #: WSC 36575 002 1048576
   VCID: 05566BB8C924746360D-8050

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3C0 905 861 J
   Component:    ELV          029 0380
   3C0905861J     ELV          029 0380   

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 2E: Media Player 3 (J650)       Labels:. 5N0-035-342.lbl
   Part No SW: 5N0 035 342 D    HW: 5N0 035 342 D
   Component: SG EXT.PLAYER H13 0150  
   Revision: A1001003    Serial number: 7669363451    
   Coding: 010000
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 2808020C12F6490B3BB-807C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr (J810)       Labels: 3C0-959-760.lbl
   Part No SW: 3C8 959 760 A    HW: 3C8 959 760 A
   Component: Sitzmemory    H05 2301  
   Revision: 00H05000    
   Coding: 000039
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 3332E560DB303AD39E9-8066

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation (J0506)       Labels:. 1T0-035-680.clb
   Part No SW: 1T0 035 680 C    HW: 1T0 035 680 C
   Component: RNS-MID       H50 2840  
   Revision: AB001001    Serial number: VWZ6Z7L5044050
   Coding: 04050002010000A000
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 2E04F4143012173BF17-807A

1 Fault Found:
01303 - Telephone Transceiver (R36) 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00100100
                    Fault Priority: 5
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 179
                    Mileage: 160847 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.12.13
                    Time: 07:44:56


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 42: Door Elect, Driver (J386)       Labels:| 3C0-959-70X-GEN4.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 959 701 A    HW: 3C0 959 793 C
   Component: TUER-SG FT    002 0529  
   Revision: 12110009    Serial number: 0002212593
   Coding: 0011FF
   Shop #: WSC 05311 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_TSGFPQ35BRFVW46X A04001
   ROD: EV_TSGFPQ35BRFVW46X_VW32.rod
   VCID: 3536DB78D5C424E3B0D-8060

   Slave Driver: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3AA 959 703     HW: 3C0 959 794 B  Labels: 1K0-959-70X-GEN4.CLB
   Component: J388__TSG-HL  004 0407 
   Serial number: 00000001885036      
   Coding: 0000D8

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 5N1-909-144.clb
   Part No SW: 5N1 909 144 L    HW: 5N1 909 148 G
   Component: J500__APA-BS KL.318 0802  
   Revision: 1AH03729    Serial number: 00110330152901
   Coding: 0000258
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 3B22CD40FF60F293469-806E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels:. 3C0-959-799-46.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 959 799     HW: 3AA 959 799 
   Component: 02 KESSY PQ47   083 0323  
   Revision: 00083000    Serial number: VWZCZ000000000
   Coding: 01900A00D2C30E76300494157200CFCE705801030424B8
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 05566BB8C924746360D-8050

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 1K8 951 605 B
   Component: LIN BACKUP HORN H11 9005

   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 3C0 951 171 C
   Component: Neigungssensor  004 0611

   Subsystem 3 - Part No: 3C0 951 171 C
   Component: Innenraumueberw.004 0611

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System        Labels: 3C0-035-456.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 035 456     HW: 3AA 035 456 
   Component: DSP 10 Kanal        0020  
   Revision: 00H06001    Serial number: 75817000254206
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 6C803E1CCA8EA52B9F3-8038

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 4F: Centr. Electr. II (J520)       Labels:. 1K0-907-532.clb
   Part No SW: 7N0 907 532     HW: 1K0 907 951 
   Component: EZE_2         H41 1614  
   Revision:   H41       Serial number: 100211F1001155
   Coding: 050B0508
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 6FBA2910F7985E33BA1-803A

   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 8R0 959 591 A    HW: 8R0 959 591 
   Component: J245EE20SKB13  H02 0220 
   Serial number: 0123456789ABCDEFGHIJ

   Subsystem 2 - Part No SW: 8R0 959 591 A    HW: 8R0 959 591 
   Component: J394EE20SKB13  H02 0220 
   Serial number: 0123456789ABCDEFGHIJ

   Subsystem 3 - Part No SW: 3AA 919 204     HW: 3AA 919 204 
   Component: Analoguhr  003 0003 

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 52: Door Elect, Pass. (J387)       Labels:| 3C0-959-70X-GEN4.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 959 702 A    HW: 3C0 959 792 C
   Component: TUER-SG BT    002 0529  
   Revision: 14110009    Serial number: 0002246456
   Coding: 0011FE
   Shop #: WSC 05311 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_TSGBPQ35BRFVW46X A04001
   ROD: EV_TSGBPQ35BRFVW46X_VW32.rod
   VCID: 3634DC74C8C22FFBB97-8062

   Slave Passenger: 
   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3AA 959 704     HW: 3C0 959 795 B  Labels: 1K0-959-70X-GEN4.CLB
   Component: J389__TSG-HR  004 0407 
   Serial number: 00000001891051      
   Coding: 0000D8

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 53: Parking Brake        Labels: 3AA-907-801.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 907 801 E    HW: 3AA 907 801 E
   Component: J540 EPB4  VW-55183 0007  
   Revision:   H18       Serial number: 00000000171928
   Coding: 0022057
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 3332E560D7303AD39E9-8066

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 55: Headlight Range (J745)       Labels:. 5M0-907-357-V3.clb
   Part No SW: 5M0 907 357 E    HW: 7L6 907 357 C
   Component: AFS-ECU       H04 0080  
   Revision: --------    Serial number: --------------
   Coding: 023A00000B000200
   Shop #: WSC 05311 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_HeadlRegulVWAFSPt 002006
   ROD: EV_HeadlRegulVWAFSPt_VW46.rod
   VCID: 3634DC74C8C22FFBB97-8062

   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3D0 941 329 A    HW: 3D0 941 329 A  Labels: 3D0-941-329.CLB
   Component: LeiMo links  H04 0011 
   Coding: 230000

   Subsystem 2 - Part No SW: 3D0 941 329 A    HW: 3D0 941 329 A  Labels: 3D0-941-329.CLB
   Component: LeiMo rechts  H04 0011 
   Coding: 230000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio (J0506)       Labels:. 1T0-035-680.clb
   Part No SW: 1T0 035 680 C    HW: 1T0 035 680 C
   Component: RNS-MID       H50 2840  
   Revision: AB001001    Serial number: VWZ6Z7L5044050
   Coding: 04050002010000A000
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 2E04F4143012173BF17-807A

1 Fault Found:
01303 - Telephone Transceiver (R36) 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00100100
                    Fault Priority: 5
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Reset counter: 179
                    Mileage: 160847 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2014.12.13
                    Time: 07:44:56


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 61: Battery Regul. (J840)       Labels:. 1K0-907-534.clb
   Part No SW: 7N0 907 534     HW: 1K0 907 951 
   Component: Batt.regelung H41 1614  
   Serial number: 100211F1001155
   Coding: 03221173
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 71BE2F68E1AC48C3AC5-8024

   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 3AA 915 181     HW: 3AA 915 181 
   Component: J367-BDM  H07 0150 
   Serial number: 00000000009370272717

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 65: Tire Pressure (J502)       Labels: 3AA-907-273.clb
   Part No SW: 3AA 907 273 B    HW: 3AA 907 273 B
   Component: RDKBERU30     H08 0008  
   Serial number: 10000000018139
   ASAM Dataset: EV_RDKBERU30 003010
   ROD: EV_RDKBERU30_003.rod
   VCID: 3332E560DBB03AD39E9-8066

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 69: Trailer (J345)       Labels:. 7N0-907-383.clb
   Part No SW: 7N0 907 383     HW: 7N0 907 383 
   Component: Anhaenger     H09 0101  
   Revision: 3I001002    Serial number: 00000142693020
   Coding: 4106040000000000
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 73B225609BB07AD35E9-8026

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 6C: Back-up Cam.        Labels: 5N0-907-441.clb
   Part No SW: 3C9 907 441     HW: 3C9 907 441 
   Component: J772__Rearview      0020  
   Revision: 00H09000    Serial number: 525PA8-J0Z0703
   Coding: 0030007
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 6888420CDE76890BFBB-803C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 6D: Trunk Elect.        Labels: 3C9-827-383.clb
   Part No SW: 3C9 827 383 J    HW: 3C9 827 383 J
   Component: J605  HECKDECKEL    0804  
   Revision: 00H52001    
   Shop #: WSC 05311 000 08193
   VCID: 3828D24CCE56D98BABB-806C

   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3C9 827 384 J
   Component: J756  HECKDECKEL    0804

   Subsystem 2 - Serial number: 1100H52001001C0031ÿ

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 77: Telephone (J412)       Labels:| 3C8-035-730-A.clb
   Part No SW: 5N0 035 730 D    HW: 5N0 035 730 D
   Component: Telefon       009 0511  
   Revision: --------    Serial number: 35909603110630
   Coding: 020100000000000000010000
   Shop #: WSC 00015 115 08193
   ASAM Dataset: EV_UHVPremi A01005
   ROD: EV_UHVPremi_A01.rod
   VCID: 290E0708097C7003245-807C

No fault code found.

End----(Elapsed Time: 02:19, VBatt start/end: 11.9V/11.9V. VIgn 11.9V)-----

Thank you !
 
Last edited:
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   #2  

Minikeum

Verified VCDS User
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Location
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VCDS Serial number
C?ID=396805
I forgot: I did a module 22 (AWD) Output Test.

I think I got good results:
- 3A on the pump when ON, with a typical small pump noise from below the car,
- 3A on the pump when ON, and 2A on the clutch valve when engaged,
- 0A on the pump when OFF, and 0.7A on the clutch valve when disengaged. I do get kind of a clicking noise from below during that step. Is it normal ?

Do these results appear normal to you?

Thanks !
 
   #3  

Uwe

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Jan 29, 2014
Messages
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Reaction score
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Location
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VCDS Serial number
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Rear diffs in Haldex units have been known to fail. It happened to our own Bruce in his 2010 Tiguan, shortly after he had the rear diff oil changed.

See here and check out the links to photos in the post below the one I linked to.

Note: I'm not saying that's likely your problem, just that it's a possibility.

-Uwe-
 
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Minikeum

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Thank you Uwe for the feedback.
I actually thought about doing the Haldex and rear diff oil (and filter for the Haldex) service myself, but I’m not sure it’s a good idea considering the experience of Bruce.

Yesterday I did a long drive starting late in the afternoon with 34°C OAT (93F) and finished by night at 23°C (74F), with no stop in the middle.
In the afternoon the noise was loud: the radio would not cover it. In the night, the noise was very low, I would not notice it if I didn’t know it was there.
So really température dépendant. Not sure what it could be, oil viscosity? Bearing dilatation ?

I think I’ll contact a drivetrain specialist, there is one a bit more than 1 hour away.
 
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Uwe

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I think if it's already noisy (Bruce's was not), then just changing the oil in it highly unlikely to fix the problem.

I think taking it to someone who can open it up and properly inspect the internals sounds like a good plan.

-Uwe-
 
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Hi,

So I did quick and dirty tests this (hot) afternoon. I played with tire pressure, the aim was to get the rear wheel to spin lower than the prop shaft, and then faster. This in order to have one side of the pinion teeth engaged, and then the other side.

I over inflated the rear tires, and under inflated the front ones -> rear wheel spinning slower than the shaft -> noise gone.

I did the opposite, and the noise was loud on deceleration, still present in neutral, and even while cruising. The noise would go away basically only when accelerating hard. Another symptom in that last configuration was a clunking feel (more a noise) in some cases at lower speed, when going from deceleration to acceleration. It feels like there is play in the diff pinion gear. I was not able to reproduce it all the time. Most times it was light and one time it was quite noticeable.

I only Drove 2 miles in that conf and tonight, with everything cool, i put 3bar in the rear and 2.8 in the front (nominal is 2.8 on both axle). We’ll see if that’s enough to get rid of the noise temporarily.

So all this points toward a lose pinion gear/bearing. The $3000 question now is to know if a drivetrain specialist can adjust the preload/play on that specific VW unit.
I have searched YouTube and found a few people successfully getting read of the whining noise on trucks or muscle cars, by adjusting properly the pinion gear. Sometimes with shims, sometimes with a preload nut. But I haven’t found info regarding the haldex/diff unit. Apparently VW simply exchangeA the full unit whenever there is noise, without trying to fix it before. Maybe because it is a unit designed and manufactured by a supplier hence they don’t want to mess with it.

We’ll see. I’m going on vacation this week, and I’ll make sure to put 3.4bar in the rear with the car loaded. I’ll probably contact a drivetrain specialist after. At least to get info and a quote.
 
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Bruce

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In my case, there was no way to know the bearing for the shaft from the Haldex to the diff was completely failed. There never was a noise until it disintegrated at 70mph with a huge bang, smoke, and shudder. There was no reason for all wheel to be engaged at the time - we were on flat highway surface going a bit downhill. Had been driving 5 hours at highway speed.

If I were you, I would have someone drop that diff and open it up. If you are hearing noises, you could have a unit with a bearing failing.

There was nothing wrong with the pinion. The fail is the support bearing on the input shaft from the Haldex. The pinion gears had no sign of trouble.

By the way, I took meticulous care of my Tiggy. The fluid change was not in response to a problem. It was on the mandated maintenance list for the Tiguan. We did the change. Neither my repair professional nor me expected any troubles. They did not overfill. The failure had nothing to do with the oil change. Just one of those coincidences.

Last - that fail was the scariest car fail in my 64 years of living! Tractor trailer front, back and beside... Driving in the mountains where if the car had twisted, I would not be here to tell the story. The truckers saw it happen and banged on their brakes, forming a block so I could get the car to the shoulder. But the band, the smoke, the whole experience -was something I would never wish on another!Do yourself a favor - get it checked soon!
 
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Thanks for the info Bruce! I’ll contact a garage tomorrow, see if they can do something. Found 2 other addresses as well in case the first one turns out negative.
 
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A drivetrain specialist told me it is possible to change the bearings in the haldex unit.
I got a quote at $3100 but it was unclear what is included in that price. I also asked info about changing the dual mass flywheel and DSG clutch pack so maybe he quoted $3100 for everything. Which is still expensive but Switzerland (where I live) is an expensive country.

If $3100 is only for the rear diff then I’ll find another garage, or ditch the car in the winter...
 
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Bruce

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I had a dealer nearby where the fail occur quote a price - Tiggy unseen - for the rear assembly. They wanted $4600 for it. They would not take it apart and repair it.

Local shop in town - not a dealer - did not want to touch it either.

Our tech team went to work and found a used part that came with a 12 month warranty. The part was $360 as I remember. Then one member of our tech team offered to repair the vehicle and he did so at a very nice price.

We flat bed trucked the vehicle to his shop. The repair was well done. I did get out of that car the following summer.

I now drive OssoTonka - a 2019 Honda Ridgeline. My name at Ross-Tech is Mud! I took a lot of ribbing for my choice of rides and it not being a VAG product. (incidentally, my nickname is bear hence the Osso. Tonka is because so many think the Ridgeline is a toy. If you are inclined toward Japanese who speak English, then you may want use the alternate way of speaking this name for my truck: Oh So Tonka!" :D:thumbs:
 
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It is very, very, very, very, very common for 5th gen haldex and final drive systems to get mixed up during draining or filling, both by DIY'ers and professional mechanics. The final drive drain bolt looks like a drain bolt, but the haldex drain bolt looks more like a general housing assembly bolt. And all bolts are in close proximity to each other. This results in the final drive getting drained and the haldex getting filled or the other way around, haldex oil being put into the final drive or final drive oil into the haldex systems (yes, those oils are different), one of the systems being devoid of oil after service, etc.

If you experience a failure right after service, you can kinda put money on the above having happened.

 
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Bruce

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It is very, very, very, very, very common for 5th gen haldex and final drive systems to get mixed up during draining or filling, both by DIY'ers and professional mechanics. The final drive drain bolt looks like a drain bolt, but the haldex drain bolt looks more like a general housing assembly bolt. And all bolts are in close proximity to each other. This results in the final drive getting drained and the haldex getting filled or the other way around, haldex oil being put into the final drive or final drive oil into the haldex systems (yes, those oils are different), one of the systems being devoid of oil after service, etc.

If you experience a failure right after service, you can kinda put money on the above having happened.
In my case, that was not true. That is, the repair shop that did the service is manned by a guy who services most of Ross-Tech's VAG cars. He knows that he put the right fluids in the right section. We brought the diff back to the shop and tore it down. First check was to see what fluid was in the Haldex. It was the correct fluid.

My diff had a failed bearing. It's that simple.. it was a sleeping dog and perhaps the fluid change move something in the bearing that made it fail completely - who can say.

I'll not throw my guy under the bus and blame him. Sometimes things happen.
 
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Uwe

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In my case, that was not true.
I would also suppose that your 2009-made, 2010 model (?) car did not 5th gen Haldex.

-Uwe-
 
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Thanks all for your contributions!
The $3100 before tax quote was to change the bearings of the rear diff alone.
It’s too expensive and I’ll try to find a garage that can do it for less.

They also quoted me $3500 before tax to do a DMF and DSG clutch pack replacement.
 
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