Audi A3 8L and new used instrument problem

   #1  

V3lmu

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Hello! :)

Audi A3 -02, 1,6l Gasoline engine.

The old instrument panel does not work properly for all hands/displays. Problems appear cold.
The car owner had purchased a instrument cluster from a car dismantler.
Original and broken instrument cluster part number: 8L0920900L. New used instrument cluster part number: 8L0920900C.

I tried to adapt the new used instrument, but the attempt fails to Determining IMMO-ID & VIN (Instrument Cluster) . The VCDS does not display the car's VIN.
I have tried to do this by the end of vin code without views, but coding stops at this point the error message: VALUE SYSTEM NOT OK :confused:
Code:
[Adaptation - 10]
Enter 050 in "Channel Number".
[Read]
For the following procedure, use the PIN of the OLD (ORIGINAL) instrument cluster.

    4-digit PIN
        Enter zero followed by the 4-digit PIN directly in the New Value field. For example, if your PIN is 1234, enter 01234.

[Test]

    The values may change to "32000", this is normal

[Save]
[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]

    Switch OFF the ignition and let the car sit for ~1 minute, then switch ON the ignition again.
    Verify that the REPLACEMENT (NEW or USED) instrument cluster now shows the VIN/IMMO-ID of the vehicle now.
ORIGINAL INSTRUCTIONS
Code:
Determining IMMO-ID & VIN (ECU)

[Select]
[01 - Engine]
Look at the first "Extra" field. The first 17-digit string is the VIN. The second 14-digit string in the Immo-ID.
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]

---OR---

[Select]
[01 - Engine]
[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Select Block 081.
[Go!]
The first 17-digit string is the VIN. The second 14-digit string in the Immo-ID..
[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]


Determining IMMO-ID & VIN (Instrument Cluster)

[Select]
[17 - Instruments]
Look at the first "Extra" field. The first 17-digit string is the VIN. The second 14-digit string in the Immo-ID.
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]

---OR---

[Select]
[17 - Instruments]
[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Select Block 081.
[Go!]
The first 17-digit string is the VIN. The second 14-digit string in the Immo-ID..
[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]


Instrument Cluster Swapping

Prerequisites:

    The new or used cluster is installed in the car.
    Battery voltage at least 12.0 V.
    All relevant coding and adaptation values have been transferred from the OLD (ORIGINAL) cluster to the REPLACEMENT (NEW or USED) cluster.
        Immo 3 Audi vehicles typically use adaptation channels 060, 061 and 062 for the internal installation list since they do not have address 19-CAN Gateway. If in question, run a complete Adaptation Control Module Map with the old module installed.
        Immo 3 VW vehicles typically use short coding in address 19-CAN Gateway. If the original value is 00006, which is common, recode the new unit to the same value to refresh the internal gateway installation list.
    Make sure to have BOTH PIN's, from the OLD (ORIGINAL) and the REPLACEMENT (NEW or USED) instrument cluster.
    Make sure to have the Radio Code (for factory radios only).


[Select]
[17 - Instruments]


[Login - 11]
For the following procedure, use the PIN of the REPLACEMENT (NEW or USED) instrument cluster.

    4-digit PIN
        Enter zero followed by the 4-digit PIN directly in the Login field. For example, if your PIN is 1234, enter 01234.

[Do it!]


[Adaptation - 10]
Enter 050 in "Channel Number".
[Read]
For the following procedure, use the PIN of the OLD (ORIGINAL) instrument cluster.

    4-digit PIN
        Enter zero followed by the 4-digit PIN directly in the New Value field. For example, if your PIN is 1234, enter 01234.

[Test]

    The values may change to "32000", this is normal

[Save]
[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]

    Switch OFF the ignition and let the car sit for ~1 minute, then switch ON the ignition again.
    Verify that the REPLACEMENT (NEW or USED) instrument cluster now shows the VIN/IMMO-ID of the vehicle now.


    Proceed with Key Matching now.

    Enter the odometer reading (brand new clusters only) using these instructions from the Ross-Tech website 



Special Notes

    Instructions for mileage entry on a new instrument cluster can be found here: Non-Immo Instrument Cluster Swapping
        Please note the Country Coding and Kilometer -or- Mile units prior to saving the adaptation value!
    If "Disabled" is shown in Adaptation Channel 050, the Instrument Cluster may have lock time. Check Measuring Blocks 022, 023 and 024.
How we can continue to adapt to the new used instrument?

- Can the fault be in the instrument cluster? upgrade from newer model to older model (L-> C)
- The car has a Pioneer 2-Din media player. Can this cause the coding to fail?
- I watched this tutorial video. At the beginning of the video are advised to go to 19 - CAN Gateway and copy data soft coding-section. We tried this too, but vcds can't connect to the 19-CAN Gateway. Is this necessary?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erNsVXzaeSI

Auto-Scan with new used instrument cluster
Code:
Saturday,14,December,2019,18:27:52:00464
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 19.6.2.0 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4508.4
Data version: 20190930 DS308.0
www.Ross-Tech.com

Dealer/Shop Name: J.P

Mileage: 311600km-193619mi   Repair Order: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 8L - Audi A3/S3 (1997 > 2005)
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 22 35 37 45 55 56 57 75 76
 
   Mileage: 311600km-193619miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: 06A-906-033-AVU.lbl
   Part No: 06A 906 033 J
   Component: SIMOS33 1,6l 2V 00HS3488  
   Coding: 00211
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2615F68F61F7103793B-5184
   WAUZZZ8L821004596     AUZ5Z0A8064075

4 Faults Found:
17701 - Map Controlled Engine Cooling Thermostat (F265) 
            P1293 - 35-00 - Short to Plus
17811 - EGR System 
            P1403 - 35-00 - Regulation Deviation
18058 - Powertrain Data Bus 
            P1650 - 35-10 - Missing Message from Instrument Cluster - Intermittent
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
            P1570 - 35-00 - 
Readiness: 0000 1000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ESP-F.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 907 379 E
   Component: ESP FRONT MK60      0104  
   Coding: 0011266
   Shop #: WSC 01236 785 00200
   VCID: 2C0104A77A1B2A6745F-51A8

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No: 8L0 820 043 J
   Component: A3  KLIMAAUTOMAT   0105  
   Coding: 01040
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2F3B13AB4E0D517F60D-259E

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 8L0-959-655-AI8.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 959 655 K
   Component: Airbag Front+Kopf  5008  
   Coding: 00304
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 46D5560FC1B7F037B3B-5184

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 8L0-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 920 900 C
   Component: AB-KOMBIINSTR. VDO D09   
   Coding: 08142
   Shop #: WSC 00222  
   VCID: 2B0307BB7A152D5F4C5-5184

   Component: AUZ7Z0X1277269  
   ÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿÿ     AUZ7Z0X1277269

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 35: Centr. Locks        Labels:. 8D0-862-257.clb
   Part No: 8D0 862 257 B
   Component: ZV-Pumpe, Funk      D16  
   Coding: 14913
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2C0104A77F1B2A6745F-4F2E

No fault code found.

End----------(Elapsed Time: 03:36, VBatt start/end: 12.5V/12.2V)-----------
 
   #2  

Uwe

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Audi clusters of this vintage do not have a separately addressable CAN Gateway. Instead, they have some data resembling an installation list in Adaptation Channels 60-62, so you should probably get the values from those channels and save it for posterity.

I really don't think the radio has anything to do with this.

Do you have both PINs, the one for the car / original cluster, and the one for the replacement cluster?

-Uwe-
 
   #3  

V3lmu

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Do you have both PINs, the one for the car / original cluster, and the one for the replacement cluster?
-Uwe-
Yes, we have both the original instrument cluster pin-code and the new used instrument cluster pin-code too.
 
   #4  

V3lmu

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Progress report.

We have tried with the same parts / tools as we did in recent writings.

We have tried to remove the immobilizer VAG Immo Gold Edition, but the car's ECU does not recognize the tool. We've tried adjusting the dashboard to operate at high volts, as the guide said, but that didn't work either. I suspect instrument panel version C is incompatible with the ECU. The professional will try to disable the immobilizer. More will be reported as the matter progresses
 
   #5  

Jack@European_Parts

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Radio code is in cluster, different & unrelated.......... :rolleyes:

Part FOD, Wait times not expired, with wait for channel open or Immobilizer status must be reset with authorized security access or external tool not approved by VAG!



Vehicle Identification No.WAUZZZ8L821004596
ModelAudi A3 1,6
A3
Date of production12.09.2001
Model year2002
Sales type8L1BA4
Engine CodeAVU
Transmission CodeDUU

Emission standard0GGEmission standard EU4


PART NUMBER
DESCRIPTIONREMARKMODEL


* 8L0 920 900 LXinstrument cluster260KM/HOtto engine
Dropped: Aug 1, 2017 (EKZ: L)
Vehicle intelligent genuine part.
Order only with additional instructions.
Super session

PART NUMBERDESCRIPTIONREMARKMODEL
* 8L0 920 900 Linstrument cluster
Dropped on Jul 1, 2019, without replacement (EKZ: O)
Vehicle intelligent genuine part.
Order only with additional instructions.
 
Last edited:
   #6  

V3lmu

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Radio code is in cluster, different & unrelated.......... :rolleyes:
VagTacho show very easy that code, both clusters.

Part FOD, Wait times not expired, with wait for channel open or Immobilizer status must be reset with authorized security access or external tool not approved by VAG!

We waiting 2 weeks and try again, but no results :(
 
   #8  

Uwe

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   #9  

V3lmu

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Situation Update

Owner returned new used instrument (8L0920900C) and bought new used instrument (8L0920900L/Same as original)

We were able to complete the instrument adjustment, but the data from the previous instrument did not transfer to the new used instrument.

I checked the DTCs with both dashboards in place.

OLD ORIGINAL
Code:
Saturday,07,March,2020,13:27:22:00464
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 19.6.2.2 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4508.4
Data version: 20200210 DS308.0
[url]www.Ross-Tech.com[/url]

Dealer/Shop Name: J.P - V3lmu

VIN: WAUZZZ8L821004596   License Plate: 7.3.20
Mileage: 284720km-176916mi   Repair Order: Vanha mittaristo



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 8L (8L - Audi A3/S3 (1997 > 2005))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 22 35 37 45 55 56 57 75 76
 
VIN: WAUZZZ8L821004596   Mileage: 284720km-176916miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: 06A-906-033-AVU.lbl
   Part No: 06A 906 033 J
   Component: SIMOS33 1,6l 2V 00HS3488  
   Coding: 00211
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2615F68F61F71037939-5160
   WAUZZZ8L821004596     AUZ5Z0A8064075

2 Faults Found:
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
            P1570 - 35-10 -  - Intermittent
18058 - Powertrain Data Bus 
            P1650 - 35-10 - Missing Message from Instrument Cluster - Intermittent
Readiness: 1010 0101

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ESP-F.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 907 379 E
   Component: ESP FRONT MK60      0104  
   Coding: 0011266
   Shop #: WSC 01236 785 00200
   VCID: 2C0104A77A1B2A6745D-5160

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No: 8L0 820 043 J
   Component: A3  KLIMAAUTOMAT   0105  
   Coding: 01040
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2F3B13AB4E0D517F60F-2596

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 8L0-959-655-AI8.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 959 655 K
   Component: Airbag Front+Kopf  5008  
   Coding: 00304
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 46D5560FC1B7F037B39-5160

1 Fault Found:
01211 - Belt Tensioner Igniter; Rear Driver Side (N196) 
            32-10 - Resistance Too High - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 8L0-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 920 900 L
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. M73 D02  
   Coding: 08142
   Shop #: WSC 45259  
   VCID: 34311CC7A72B72A71DD-4B1E
   WAUZZZ8L821004596     AUZ5Z0A8064075

2 Faults Found:
01039 - Coolant Temperature Sensor (G2) 
            29-00 - Short to Ground
01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System 
            37-10 - Faulty - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 35: Centr. Locks        Labels:. 8D0-862-257.clb
   Part No: 8D0 862 257 B
   Component: ZV-Pumpe, Funk      D16  
   Coding: 14913
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2C0104A77F1B2A6745D-4F0C

No fault code found.

End----(Elapsed Time: 03:43, VBatt start/end: 11.9V/11.7V. VIgn 11.6V)-----
NEW USED (SAME AS ORIGINAL)
Code:
Saturday,07,March,2020,13:36:00:00464
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 19.6.2.2 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4508.4
Data version: 20200210 DS308.0
[url]www.Ross-Tech.com[/url]

Dealer/Shop Name: J.P - V3lmu

VIN: WAUZZZ8L43A052419   License Plate: 7.3.20
Mileage: 239310km-148700mi   Repair Order: Uusi käytetty mittaristo



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 8L (8L - Audi A3/S3 (1997 > 2005))
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 16 17 22 35 37 45 55 56 57 75 76
 
VIN: WAUZZZ8L43A052419   Mileage: 239310km-148700miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: 06A-906-033-AVU.lbl
   Part No: 06A 906 033 J
   Component: SIMOS33 1,6l 2V 00HS3488  
   Coding: 00211
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2615F68F61F71037939-5160
   WAUZZZ8L821004596     AUZ5Z0A8064075

2 Faults Found:
17978 - Engine Start Blocked by Immobilizer 
            P1570 - 35-00 - 
18058 - Powertrain Data Bus 
            P1650 - 35-10 - Missing Message from Instrument Cluster - Intermittent
Readiness: 1010 0101

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ESP-F.lbl
   Part No: 1C0 907 379 E
   Component: ESP FRONT MK60      0104  
   Coding: 0011266
   Shop #: WSC 01236 785 00200
   VCID: 2C0104A77A1B2A6745D-5184

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: Redir Fail!
   Part No: 8L0 820 043 J
   Component: A3  KLIMAAUTOMAT   0105  
   Coding: 01040
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2F3B13AB4E0D517F60F-2596

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 8L0-959-655-AI8.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 959 655 K
   Component: Airbag Front+Kopf  5008  
   Coding: 00304
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 46D5560FC1B7F037B39-5160

1 Fault Found:
01211 - Belt Tensioner Igniter; Rear Driver Side (N196) 
            32-10 - Resistance Too High - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 8L0-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 8L0 920 900 L
   Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. M73 D07  
   Coding: 00044
   Shop #: WSC 00000  
   VCID: 34311CC7A72B72A71DD-4B1E
   WAUZZZ8L43A052419     AUZ5Z0B9218206

3 Faults Found:
01176 - Key 
            65-10 - Unauthorized - Intermittent
01179 - Incorrect Key Programming 
            35-00 - -
01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System 
            37-00 - Faulty

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 35: Centr. Locks        Labels:. 8D0-862-257.clb
   Part No: 8D0 862 257 B
   Component: ZV-Pumpe, Funk      D16  
   Coding: 14913
   Shop #: WSC 01236  
   VCID: 2C0104A77F1B2A6745D-4F0C

No fault code found.

End----(Elapsed Time: 03:45, VBatt start/end: 11.4V/11.5V. VIgn 11.4V)-----
I found the same fault code between the old instrument panel and the new used instrument panel, even though they were reset during replacement.

01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty

We checked here what this code means. http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/01336

We checked the instrument connectors, the instrument wires and fuses, but everything was fine.

What next? :confused:

PS. We checked the lock-in time, but fortunately it showed 0.
 
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   #11  

Uwe

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01336 - Company Data Bus for Comfort System
37-00 - Faulty
Have you checked wiring diagrams to determine everywhere this bus goes?

-Uwe-
 
   #12  

V3lmu

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How did you qualify the wiring?

We checked the above points visually as much as could be seen from the wires, connectors and fuses.

We do not have car electric workshop tools.

Have you checked wiring diagrams to determine everywhere this bus goes?
Unfortunately, we are not. :(
 
   #13  

PetrolDave

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Sounds like you need to login to erWin and get the wiring diagrams for your A3.

The wiring tools you need are simple, and should be found in any decent motor factors - and there will be a lot of people in Oulu who have them (ex-Nokia people I am thinking - I visited Oulu over 50 times whilst I worked for Nokia Networks).
 
   #14  

V3lmu

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I forgot to write a post about my previous post there. After all, the car had a retrofit player (Pioneer 1-din).

Maybe the code I suspect comes from that. :rolleyes:

Immo 3 Audi vehicles typically use adaptation channels 060, 061 and 062 for the internal installation list since they do not have address 19-CAN Gateway. If in question, run a complete Adaptation Control Module Map with the old module installed.
I read those instructions again and was told to check channels 060, 061 and 062. I did not check these before adjusting to the new instrument panel. What information do you get from these channels? and it is important check this channel? :confused:
 
   #15  

V3lmu

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We tried to adjust the instrument cluster again. Before the instrument cluster operation returned to factory settings after which the instrument adjustment and key adjustment. Unfortunately, this did not work either.
We tried to adjust the instrument cluster with IMMO 2 instructions, but it failed.

We are thinking with the owner that
- Will the original instrument cluster be repaired?
- Can I transfer data from the old instrument cluster to the new used instrument cluster?
- Immobilizer bypass

These 060, 061 and 062 channels have now also been studied, but no information is available from them.

What would be the easiest and cheapest solution?
 
   #16  

Dana

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I noticed the voltage was low in the more recent scans dated Saturday,07,March,2020. Immo matching can fail (or get goofy) under 12V so make sure a battery charger is connected when you are performing the Adaptation steps.

Also, make sure you were firstly matching the used cluster per the Immo 3 page prior to attempting to match original keys. If the Engine -and- Instrument cluster do not share the same VIN and serial number due to a failed matching attempt then keys will not program.

Next, those Adp channels are documented in our German label file and I'm reasonably confident that 060 (at the least) would be used. I'll paste the native text here so you can paste it into a translator if needed:

Code:
A060,0,Verbauliste Datenbus Antrieb
A060,5,Verbauliste Datenbus Antrieb
A060,6,00000 = Motor und Kombiinstrument (Wegfahrsperre II)
A060,7,01025 = Motor und Kombiinstrument (Wegfahrsperre III)
A060,8,01027 = Motor und Automatikgetriebe sowie Kombiinstrument (Wegfahrsperre III)
;
A061,0,Verbauliste Datenbus Komfort
A061,5,Verbauliste Datenbus Komfort (nur Kombiinstrument Midline)
A061,6,+00256 = Kombiinstrument (nur zusammen mit Radio oder Telefon)
A061,7,+04096 = Radio (ab MJ 2002)
A061,8,+08192 = Telefon (Festeinbau)
;
A62,0,Verbauliste Datenbus Infotainment
A62,5,Verbauliste Datenbus Infotainment (nur Kombiinstrument Highline)
A62,6,+01 = Radio (ab MJ 2002)
A62,7,+04 = Navigation
A62,8,+08 = Telematik (Rest der Welt) ohne Multifunktionslenkrad (MFL)
A62,9,+10 = Telematik (Rest der Welt) mit Multifunktionslenkrad (MFL)
Please let us know if all 3 of them shown an Error without a stored value in the lower left corner.

Lastly, when things aren't working as planned I often recommend reinstalling all original parts and making the car start/run again. At that point it doesn't hurt to try re-matching one of the original keys to confirm the value in MVB 022.4 changed from the original value to a new value of only 1. Doing so should help rule out the possibility that there's a communication issue between VCDS and/or the PC and the car. It also helps confirm that the original PIN is giving you proper access to the needed Immo channels.

In regards to
- Can I transfer data from the old instrument cluster to the new used instrument cluster?
That's the best option and it should have transferred using the Immo 3 cluster swapping steps.

Using 3rd party tools to write the old cluster data directly into the used unit works in some cases but I managed to create a temporary cluster paperweight playing EEPROM games due to a hardware level difference in a VDO cluster many years ago so ... I would consider that a last resort. It shouldn't be necessary (and we cannot offer support for those steps in this forum).​
 
   #17  

V3lmu

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Problem solved.

The car electronics workshop will copy the data from the original instrument cluster to the new used instrument cluster. Then the instrument cluster installation and everything works.

However, this remains a mystery as to why this did not succeed with instructions. Would it be the spirit of the world thing? ;)
 
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