Dreaded P0441 Evap Code

   #1  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
Who has all got the dreaded p0441 evap code and there is no leak. I ran the groups 70 and 71 and my shop says there is an issue with evap system. No leak like I had hoped but could be anything. I already changed the small evap purge valave by the air filter. Im not sure what else to do. He said the signal could be bad to the purge valve or a block somewhere. How would I go about finding a block? Any help would be great. Thanks
 
   #2  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
Sorry P0441

Sorry p0441QUOTE=cschmitz20;180651]Who has all got the dreaded p0441 evap code and there is no leak. I ran the groups 70 and 71 and my shop says there is an issue with evap system. No leak like I had hoped but could be anything. I already changed the small evap purge valave by the air filter. Im not sure what else to do. He said the signal could be bad to the purge valve or a block somewhere. How would I go about finding a block? Any help would be great. Thanks[/QUOTE]
 
   #3  

Uwe

Benevolent Dictator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
30,369
Reaction score
21,668
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
HC100001
It's will be difficult for anyone to give you any kind worthwhile feedback on this since you didn't even mention what kind of car you're having this problem on.

Please post an Auto-Scan for context.

-Uwe-
 
   #4  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
PO441 CODE

Anyone get this dreaded code? See it could be the purge valve but already changed that. Seems it could be a number of things. Mechanic mentioned a block? How do I clean out lines? Just run air through the lines?
 
   #5  

Uwe

Benevolent Dictator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
30,369
Reaction score
21,668
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
HC100001
   #6  

Jack@European_Parts

NostraJackAss
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
20,649
Reaction score
8,797
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
Hello and welcome to the VCDS forum OP!

Mighty vac tester with vacuum plug caps to isolate zones anyone?

Did you JPPSG yet in this forums sticky?

https://forums.ross-tech.com/showth...essional-Problem-Solver-Guide-quot-JPPSG-quot

Please post an auto-scan and consider the RTFB!

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Official_Factory_Repair_Information

Is the N80 purge valve you changed correct part and is it installed in correct direction?

Are there any multiplicative vacuum leaks at intake or brake booster circuit?
 
Last edited:
   #7  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
It's will be difficult for anyone to give you any kind worthwhile feedback on this since you didn't even mention what kind of car you're having this problem on.

Please post an Auto-Scan for context.

-Uwe-
It is a 2003 Audi A4 Cabriolet 3.0
 
   #8  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
It is a 2003 Audi A4 Cabriolet 3.0
 
   #9  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
It is a 2003 Audi A4 Cabriolet 3.0
 
   #10  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
The N80 valve I bought was from eBay and it was unbranded from China. Would it be worthwhile to try another one that isn't from China? I did test it with voltage and it seems to open and close as I can blow air through it but there could be more to it then that? It seems to easy to be a simple part like the N80 valve that's not expensive and easy to replace. my mechanic also mentioned there could be a block? Do I just blow air through the hoses to clear the out?
 
   #11  

Jack@European_Parts

NostraJackAss
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
20,649
Reaction score
8,797
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
The N80 valve I bought was from eBay and it was unbranded from China. Would it be worthwhile to try another one that isn't from China? I did test it with voltage and it seems to open and close as I can blow air through it but there could be more to it then that? It seems to easy to be a simple part like the N80 valve that's not expensive and easy to replace. my mechanic also mentioned there could be a block? Do I just blow air through the hoses to clear the out?

OP, It would be worthwhile to JPPSG and post an auto-scan, right guys? :p

Stop taking short cuts........
 
   #13  

Jack@European_Parts

NostraJackAss
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
20,649
Reaction score
8,797
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
Sorry what is JPPSG? I am new here so please forgive me. I have sent in an autoscan. Not sure what you are referring to by short cuts?​



Not providing the data direct in the forum means people external to RT cant help you with the vague data not seen or described by you!

Shortcuts are changing parts without proper tests done to qualify a DTC.






Post the auto-scan here in forum and here is how in video below.

JPPSG here........

https://forums.ross-tech.com/showth...essional-Problem-Solver-Guide-quot-JPPSG-quot



 
   #14  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
Sorry I will post my scan. As far as the short cuts my mechanic advised replacing the purge valve as that is the most common and least expensive and easy to replace parts. So who wouldn't try that first? I am getting conflicting answers from tech here and my mechanic. I was told vacuum leaks could not possibly cause an evap code. But i received an email from tech advising to check for vacuum leaks around the manifold . Now as far as evap lines. I see there is a line going to the engine area from one end of the n80 valve and then the other line I believe goes to the back of the car. When I run smoke through the line that goes to the back of the car I see no smoke. But when I run smoke through the hose that comes out of the other side of the n 80 valve to the engine area I get smoke coming out of the one of the vacuum lines that is going into the manifold. I am also still getting some random misfired even after replacing the maf sensor. Not sure if that small vacuum leak could cause random misfiring and that evap code or if I could have 2 separate issues?
 
   #15  

Jack@European_Parts

NostraJackAss
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
20,649
Reaction score
8,797
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
So who wouldn't try that first?
Me because it's a waste of money unless needed & what would be the point of mechanical tests with complimented OBD tests purported if we just throw parts at shit?

I was told vacuum leaks could not possibly cause an evap code.
Did you know whoever told you that is an idiot?

Now as far as evap lines. I see there is a line going to the engine area from one end of the n80 valve and then the other line I believe goes to the back of the car. When I run smoke through the line that goes to the back of the car I see no smoke. But when I run smoke through the hose that comes out of the other side of the n 80 valve to the engine area I get smoke coming out of the one of the vacuum lines that is going into the manifold.
Did you know smoke is a poor method to perform leak tests that are switched?

Ever consider a mighty vac to do actual mechanical tests to qualify the seal of an isolated zone with crimps that are under PSI or vacuum?




I am also still getting some random misfired even after replacing the maf sensor. Not sure if that small vacuum leak could cause random misfiring and that evap code or if I could have 2 separate issues?
Could be, so how come no scan posted yet?
 
   #17  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
Here is my scan:

VCDS-Lite Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Version: Release 1.2 www.Ross-Tech.com
Workshop Code: 000 00000
Self-Diagnosis Log Friday, 25 October 2019, 12:23:52:11085
VIN Number: WAUAT48H63K022250 License Plate: Mileage: Repair Order:
Chassis Type: 8H - Audi Cabrio B6 Scan: 01,02,03,08,09,0F,11,15,16,17,18,26,36,37,45,46,55,56,57,63,65,67,73,75,76,77

------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 01: Engine Labels: 06C-909-559-ASN.LBL Controller: 8E0 909 559 E Component: 3.0L V6/5V G 0004 Coding: 0016584 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 370183920655 1 Fault Found: 16825 - EVAP Emission Control Sys: Incorrect Flow P0441 - 002 - Lower Limit Exceeded Readiness: 0010 1101
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 02: Auto Trans Labels: 01J-927-156.LBL Controller: 01J 927 156 FE Component: V30 01J 3.0l 5V USA 3031 Coding: 01001 Shop #: WSC 03213 VCID: 749B749E57A3 2 Faults Found: 18161 - Tiptronic Switch (F189): Implausible Signal P1753 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent 18265 - Load Signal: Error Message from ECU P1857 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 8E0-614-517.LBL Controller: 8E0 614 517 G Component: ABS/ESP front 2328 Coding: 04499 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 2C2BACFECF13 No fault code found.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS-Lite Self-Diagnosis Log Friday, 25 October 2019, 12:23:52:11085 Page 2
VIN Number: WAUAT48H63K022250 License Plate:
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 8E0-820-043.LBL Controller: 8E0 820 043 L Component: A4 Klimaautomat 1116 Coding: 00100 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 2A27AAE6C5E7 5 Faults Found: 00710 - Defroster Flap Positioning Motor (V107) 41-10 - Blocked or No Voltage - Intermittent 01841 - Potentiometer/Actuator for Temperature Flap; Left (G220) 30-10 - Open or Short to Plus - Intermittent 01810 - Actuating Motor for Temperature Flap; Right (V159) 41-10 - Blocked or No Voltage - Intermittent 00716 - Air recirculation Flap Positioning Motor (V113) 41-10 - Blocked or No Voltage - Intermittent 00819 - High Pressure Sensor (G65) 07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 09: Cent. Elect. Labels: 8E0-907-279-8E2.LBL Controller: 8E0 907 279 E Component: int. Lastmodul USA 0305 Coding: 00013 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 341BB49E1723 No fault code found.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 15: Airbags Labels: 8H0-959-655-84.LBL Controller: 8H0 959 655 B Component: Airbag 8.4EC 1015 Coding: 0010105 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 390585AA3041 No fault code found.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 16: Steering wheel Labels: 8E0-953-549.LBL Controller: 8E0 953 549 N Component: Lenksáulenmodul 0308 Coding: 02041 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 3E0F96B6296F 3 Faults Found: 01304 - Radio 49-00 - No Communications 00884 - Ignition Switch (D) Terminal X 57-10 - Electric Circuit Failure - Intermittent 00885 - Ignition Switch (D) Terminal 50 57-10 - Electric Circuit Failure - Intermittent
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS-Lite Self-Diagnosis Log Friday, 25 October 2019, 12:23:52:11085 Page 3
VIN Number: WAUAT48H63K022250 License Plate:
Address 17: Instruments Labels: 8E0-920-9xx-8E2.LBL Controller: 8H0 920 950 E Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRS. RB4 D16 Coding: 02201 Shop #: WSC 03213 VCID: 2E2FA6F6F90F WAUAT48H63K022250 AUZ6Z0B0400950 2 Faults Found: 00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent 01304 - Radio 49-00 - No Communications
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 26: Auto Roof Labels: 8H0-959-255.LBL Controller: 8H0 959 255 B Component: VSG B6 CABRIO 7195 Coding: 0000000 Shop #: WSC 02101 VCID: 351D899A1C59 4 Faults Found: 02000 - Switch Position 008 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent 01997 - Convertible Top Locking Motor (V223) 011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent 00466 - Control Module for Steering Column Electronics (J527) 004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent 00470 - Combination comfort Databus in Single Wire 000 - - - Intermittent
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr Labels: None Controller: 8H0 959 760 Component: Sitzmemory EE H04 X013 Coding: 00002 Shop #: WSC 00065 VCID: F49BF49ED7A3 2 Faults Found: 00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent 02010 - Left Entry Assistance Control Module (J572) 79-00 - Please Check Fault Codes
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VCDS-Lite Self-Diagnosis Log Friday, 25 October 2019, 12:23:52:11085 Page 4
VIN Number: WAUAT48H63K022250 License Plate:
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 8E0-959-433-MAX.LBL Controller: 8H0 959 433 C Component: Komfortgerát T7B 1412 Coding: 11788 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 341BB49E1723 3 Faults Found: 01134 - Alarm Horn (H12) 49-00 - No Communications 01333 - Door Control Module; Rear Left (J388) 37-00 - Faulty 01334 - Door Control Module; Rear Right (J398) 37-00 - Faulty
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 55: Xenon Range Labels: 4Z7-907-357.LBL Controller: 4Z7 907 357 Component: dynamische LWR D09 Coding: 00070 Shop #: WSC 00672 VCID: 047B245E0703 No fault code found.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 63: Entry Assist,D Labels: None Controller: 8H0 959 760 A Component: EasyEntry F M H11 X023 Coding: 00006 Shop #: WSC 00065 VCID: 351D899A1C59 1 Fault Found: 00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent
------------------------------------------------------------------------------Address 73: Entry Assist, P Labels: None Controller: 8H0 959 760 A Component: EasyEntry BF H11 X023 Coding: 00005 Shop #: WSC 00000 VCID: 351D899A1C59 3 Faults Found: 00668 - Supply Voltage Terminal 30 07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent 01900 - Passengers Seat Fore / Aft Adjusting Motor (V31) 44-00 - Short Circuit 01794 - Control Module - Incorrect Chassis (VIN) Number 35-00 -
End -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------





Reply, Reply All or Forward




familyguy4419@yahoo.com

cschmitz20@yahoo.com
 
   #18  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
We did find a gash in a vacuum leak that connected directly to the manifold, I wonder if that has been causing my issues. We found it smoke and had no smoke anywhere else.
 
   #19  

Jack@European_Parts

NostraJackAss
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
20,649
Reaction score
8,797
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
We did find a gash in a vacuum leak that connected directly to the manifold, I wonder if that has been causing my issues. We found it smoke and had no smoke anywhere else.
Huh yeah I wonder?
Are there any multiplicative vacuum leaks at intake or brake booster circuit?
https://forums.ross-tech.com/showth...0041-Evap-Code&p=180890&viewfull=1#post180890

Thank you for posting the scan......... I think it's a blob! :rolleyes:

Vehicle Identification No.WAUAT48H63K022250
ModelAudi A4 Cabrio. 3,0
AA4C
Date of production20.01.2003
Model year2003
Sales type8H75FH
Engine CodeAVK
Transmission CodeGGR


NOW DO YOU SEE THE DISCREPANCY OF YOUR THREAD TITLE VERSUS AUTO-SCAN & WHY NEEDED?

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16825/P0441/001089

16825/P0441/001089 - EVAP Emission Control Sys: Incorrect Flow

Possible Symptoms


  • Malfunction Indicator Light (MIL) active
Possible Causes


  • Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister Purge Regulator Valve (N80) faulty/jammed
  • Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister Purge Solenoid Valve (N115) faulty/jammed
  • Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister Sealing faulty
  • Pipes between Tank Breathing and Throttle Body leaky/blocked
Possible Solutions


  • Check Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister Purge Regulator Valve (N80)
    • Perform Output Test
  • Check Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister Purge Solenoid Valve (N115)
  • Check Evaporative Emission (EVAP) Canister
    • Perform Basic Setting
  • Check Pipes between Tank Breathing and Throttle Body
Special Notes


  • When found in the NAR 1.8T Audi A4 1.8T check TSB 24-08-78 or 2010268/3 or Pass-Thru equivalent TSB
  • When found in the NAR 1.8T VW Passat 1.8T check TSB 01-09-09 or 2005554 or Pass-Thru equivalent TSB
    • Note: The Passat 26E5 or "R5" recall includes the same software update
  • Make sure the quick release lines for the N80 valve and vacuum line to LDP are not crossed.
    • This can also make the engine hard to start after filling up the fuel tank.
 
Last edited:
   #20  

cschmitz20

Verified VCDS-Lite User
Verified
Joined
Oct 25, 2019
Messages
92
Reaction score
3
Location
USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=385099
Thanks for the info. I was wondering about the N80 valve vs the N115 valve. Of course I read online an google stuff so when I saw the possible causes of my evap code, it lists N80 valve and N115 valve. Now there is vast information on both of them. Would my car have both of them? I see where there is the part number for the same car in South Korea. It says it's the same part as the N80 valve in the USA. It just has a different part number on the South Korea model. I also saw where is mentions this part is the rear driver's side wheel well. I already took apart the passenger side apart so before I go ripping the other side apart, i just want to know if there is another purge valve in my car at the rear like I saw referenced online. Thanks
 
Top