DPF just cleaned - how to reset things with VCDS

   #1  

grittysoup

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Excuse the simple phrase, I am new to VCDS, hello to all.

Just bought a van, which we believe was subjected to strictly city driving - with possible interrupted regens, and limited motorway driving, it appears the van has spent its life in and out of the VW Dealers to deal with multiple DPF warnings.

I have removed the DPF from this VW Crafter 08, 72k miles, 2.5 TDI R5 CR.

The DPF was soaked and cleaned using Wynn's 'Off Car DPF Cleaner.

I also cleaned the EGR, inlet manifold, and Turbo of soot/carbon. The dealer advised replacement of all these parts and DPF, but after removal and cleaning here they seem fine.

These parts were all refitted - and the engine left sat running on tick over for about hour since, today it goes for short drive for an MOT and back, so minimal mileage.
So there will be some soot build up since cleaning that will need to be accounted for.

I have No error codes related to this.

I have tried following this guidance to 'reset' the DPF settings:
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/2.0L_CR_TDI

But cannot get past Security Access,
"Engine Control Unit (J623) Security Access"
"Prior to adapting a new USED Engine COntrol Unit the vehicle specific PIN/SKC (IMMI-Login) of the new USED Engine Control Unit has to be used to enable the adaptation.
You'll find the PIN/SKC on the Key Tag of the additional Key (of the donor car) or you can acquire it through your responsible Distribution Centre or Importer."

A call to VW to request the PIN/SKC code on the vehicle I now own - inform me that they 'are unable to disclose such information' :( ... isn't there some legal case with John Deere equipment in the US going through that will force such manufacturers to disclose - so we can do repairs ourselves, another topic for another day I am sure.

Assume the above wiki article deals just with the ash, but I will also need to account for some of the recent soot build up since cleaning - I have seen inside the Long Adaptation channel 'Carbon Mass (ECM/DPF Replacement) using I think 'Basic Settings' but could not save anything ... Particle Filter Carbon Mass is reading 56, do I understand it right that a grams per Km figure would need to be calculated and entered into 'new value' (after entering '1' first to reset the DPF completely) the stored value is reading 5636 currently. Consumption Since Regen is reading 1.61.

Should a forced regen be preformed perhaps - and then reset, or reset and then try and guess a soot value
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Diesel_Particle_Filter_Emergency_Regeneration

Can anyone help, and are the above 'routine's the correct ones to perform in my situation - I am not replacing a DPF, however in my research so far I gather there is no adaptation for 'cleaning' ... just replacement.

I note the Post on 'DPF statistics' in the 'how to' section ... looks interesting - if I hopefully have that adaptation.

Thanks



Here is my autoscan if of interest:


Code:
Sunday,09,June,2019,21:56:59:43490
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 19.6.0.4 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4505.4
Data version: 20190529 DS308.0
[url]www.Ross-Tech.com[/url]


VIN: WV1ZZZ2EZ86033313   License Plate: 
Mileage: 72903   Repair Order: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Chassis Type: 2E (2E - VW Crafter Panel Van (LT3 / 2006 > 2016))
Scan: 01 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 9A 9B 9C 9D 9E 9F A0 A1 A2 A3
          B0 B1 B2 B3 B4 B5 B6 C1
 
VIN: WV1ZZZ2EZ86033313   
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 93: LT3 Immo        Labels: 2E0-905-865-93.clb
   Part No SW: 2E0 905 843 D    HW: 906 900 380 3
   Component: IMMO          1423  1322  
   Revision: 00423000    Serial number: VWZDZ0Q4002050
   Shop #: WSC 65439 002 1048576
   VCID: 2809F9BA0EF98567A27-807C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 94: LT3 Airbag 
   Part No HW: 9064461442
   Shop #: WSC 00117 555 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 3 3332
   ROD: CRFT_AB_3_3331.rod (*)
   VCID: 55F7804E658BC88FC91-8000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 95: LT3 ESP 
   Part No SW: 9064481553    HW: 0004460053
   Shop #: WSC 00117 555 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 3 4099
   ROD: CRFT_ESP_3_36928.rod (*)
   VCID: 0D47A82E8DDBC04FB11-8058

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 96: LT3 Instruments 
   Part No SW: 9064482021    HW: 0034468021
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 32 776
   ROD: CRFT_KOMBI_32_776.rod
   VCID: 04518D0ADE918107EEF-8050

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 99: LT3 Ign. Switch 
   Part No HW: 9069003803
   Shop #: WSC 00000 288 01315
   ASAM Dataset: 67 259
   ROD: CRFT_EZS_67_259.rod
   VCID: 55F7804E658BC88FC91-8000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 9A: LT3 Central Locks        Labels: 2E0-905-865-93.clb
   Part No SW: 2E0 905 843 D    HW: 906 900 380 3
   Component: HF-FFB        1423  1322  
   Revision: 00423000    Serial number: 12345678901234
   Shop #: WSC 00082 210 103452
   VCID: 2809F9BA0EF98567A27-807C

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 9B: LT3 Driver Door 
   Part No HW: 9068203926
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 33 771
   ROD: CRFT_FTUHR_33_771.rod (*)
   VCID: 55F7804E658BC88FC91-8000

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address B0: LT3 Roof Display 
   Part No SW: 9064480323    HW: 9068203601
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 21 3
   ROD: CRFT_DBE_21_3.rod (*)
   VCID: 074B9A06EFA7AA1F8BD-8052

1 Fault Found:
909C - Alarm Horn (H12): No or incorrect basic setting 
            Test Complete - Active/Stored

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address B1: LT3 Upper Console 
   Part No HW: 9065454107
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 67 3
   ROD: CRFT1_OBF_67_3.rod (*)
   VCID: 55F7804E658BC88FC91-8000

1 Fault Found:
9036 - Supply voltage: Limit value exceeded 
            Test Complete - Stored

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address B4: LT3 Central Elec. 
   Part No SW: 9064420600    HW: 9065450601
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 33 771
   ROD: CRFT_EZE_33_771.rod (*)
   VCID: 7F5B02E6B777E2DFB3D-802A

2 Faults Found:
9004 - Programmable Special Functions Control Module (J820) : Malfunction in control module 
            Test Complete - Active/Stored
9001 - Bulb for Left Parking Lamp (M1): Short to Plus 
            Test Complete - Stored

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address B6: LT3 Steering Wheel 
   Part No SW: 9065402345    HW: 9065402345
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   ASAM Dataset: 72 257
   ROD: CRFT_SML_72_257.rod (*)
   VCID: 06559702E8ADB317F0B-8052

No fault code found.

End----(Elapsed Time: 01:20, VBatt start/end: 11.7V/11.7V. VIgn 11.7V)-----
 
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   #2  

Uwe

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Hmm... Conspicuously absent here is the Engine, which should be at address 01 or 91 depending on exactly which ECU you have.

Can you access the engine directly with the following?

[Select]
[01-Engine]

or
[Select]
click the LT3 tab, then,
[91-Engine]

-Uwe-
 
   #3  

Jack@European_Parts

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Vehicle Identification No.WV1ZZZ2EZ86033313
Modelcrafter 35 panel
van
CR
Date of production14.02.2008
Model year2008
Sales type2ED1A5
Engine CodeBJJ
Transmission CodeHQT

Emission standard7GQExhaust concept, EURO 4 > 3.5 DPF


074 906 032 AS

EDC16CP34-4-4
 
   #4  

grant@gendan

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   #5  

grittysoup

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Thanks Grant, I will try one of these:

12233 = Freischaltung Anpassung (Allgemein)
17575 = Freischaltung Anpassung (Anpassung Aschemasse)

12233 is a good old TDI SA code but 17575 may be required for ash mass.

Uwe:
selecting 01-Engine - gave a 'no response from controller'
selecting LT3 tab, 91-Engine - allowed access.

I will post up the screen grab if required.

Once I get past the Security Access - 16, can someone clear my confusion as the best way to reset the DPF settings.

Vehicle passed MOT, and added 10 miles of driving to the cleaned DPF.
 
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Uwe

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OK, go to 91-Engine, click grab any fault codes from there (use the COPY or SAVE button and paste 'em here) and also do [Advanced ID] and post that please.

-Uwe-
 
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grittysoup

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Hi Uwe, here are the scans:

Code:
Wednesday,12,June,2019,20:49:42:43490
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows 10 x64
VCDS Version: 19.6.0.4 (x64)  HEX-V2 CB: 0.4505.4
Data version: 20190529 DS308.0
[url]www.Ross-Tech.com[/url]


VIN: WV1ZZZ2EZ86033313   License Plate: 
Mileage: 72919   Repair Order: 



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


                Address 91: LT3 Engine       Labels: 074-906-032.clb
Control Module Part Number: 074 906 032 AT    HW: 074 906 032 
  Component and/or Version: R5 2,5L EDC 0400SG  5175
           Software Coding: 0003032
            Work Shop Code: WSC 00082 210 103452
                      VCID: 6491AD8A325121074EF-8030
1 Fault Found:

000260 - Mass Air Flow Sensor (G70) 
               P0104 - 000 - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    RPM: 42 /min
                    Torque: 239.1 Nm
                    Speed: 1.0 km/h
                    Load: 0.0 %
                    Duty Cycle: 100.6 %
                    Bin. Bits: 00000010
                    Mass Air / Rev.: 805.0 mg/str
                    Mass Air / Rev.: 235.0 mg/str



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


                Address 91: LT3 Engine
Control Module Part Number: 074 906 032 AT
  Component and/or Version: R5 2,5L EDC 0400SG  5175
           Software Coding: 0003032
            Work Shop Code: WSC 00082
                      VCID: 6491AD8A325121074EF-8030

Advanced Identification
     Serial number: VWZDZ0Q4002050
     Identification: BPG-810
     Revision: --H13---
     Date: 24.08.16
     Test stand number: 1482
     Manufacturer number: 0066
Flash Status
     Programming Attempts: 0
     Successful Attempts: 0
     Programming Status: 00000000
     Required Conditions: 00000100
     Flash Tool Code: 00000 000 00000
     Flash Date: 00.00.00
Software
          
     C9FR   
Misc.
     Hardware number: 074 906 032 
     Immo Challenge: 17 16 3F A2
Car Info
     Chassis Number: WV1ZZZ2EZ86033313
VCDS Info:
       VCID: 6491AD8A325121074EF-8030
       Labels: 074-906-032.clb


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
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   #8  

Uwe

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OK, the good news is the ECU's firmware seems to be current. This is often not the case with Crafters.

The bad news is, I'm not finding any documentation for it, and the person I'd normally hit up for it is on vacation this week. I'll try an alternate channel.

Then there's that MAF fault. You should try to fix whatever is causing it. Faults like that lead to plugged DPFs.

-Uwe-
 
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Sebastian

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Cleaning a DPF with this mileage is in my opinion not worth it in the long run - especially if the car did a lot of short distance/city drive cycles. However, now that you've done that, you should be able to reset the ash mass to about 10% of it's original value and perform a forced/service regeneration after that. As Uwe already indicated, the MAF issue needs to be resolved first. For once it may be the root cause for your troubles and second it will likely block DPF related diagnostic procedures like the reset or a regeneration. When replacing the DPF at any later date, make sure to get the proper one. Early Crafter models had DPF Generation 2 from factory, but may have had it replaced with Generation 3 accompanied with a software/firmware update. Based on the data you posted, the software/firmware currently used requires a DPF3. Mixing the newer software with an older DPF and vice versa will also result in poor regeneration results and lacking emissions, as well as a failing DPF.

As far as the software/firmware levels go, there is an update to 074-906-032-AN @ 5170 available which changes the emission classification from EURO IV to EU 4 (see TPI 2021119 for details), though from regeneration wise it won't do you much good I believe. Aside from that, there is a special short distance software/firmware available (see TPI 2018140 for details) if you truly need that. I am surprised that the dealers never applied that, due to the mentioned issues.
 
   #10  

grittysoup

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Hi Sebastian, thanks for your reply.

I will look at solving the MAF issue, then trying the procedures as you advise above.

I made a note of the numbers on the side of the DPF:

Germany GLH
2EO 181 BB D-18.042
2EO 131 709 C
302013 045397 08-02-08


... none the above match this tech note:
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/P242F/009263

Depending on the Model Year and/or if the Diesel Particle Filter (DPF) has been replaced already, different Generations of the Filter may be installed. If in doubt, check the Filter Part Number. Generation 2 (DPF2) were 2E0-254-700-E and 2E0-254-700-F, while Generation 3 (DPF3) were 2E0-254-700-G/GX.


When you refer to software/firmware - I presume that is the ECU, and that can be updated using VCDS ?

Sorry, what does TPI stand for ? the '?' hover doesn't show any explanation.

Thanks
GS
 
   #11  

Jack@European_Parts

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OP as long as the DPF is not cracked or blocked it will be most likely fine if just cleaned properly.

The main cause of failure are internal fires by excessive ash and soot + not properly remediated when trying to do force regen.

Sebastian is indeed correct on the MAF, not so much with DPF speculation. It is not recommended to do force regeneration procedures for the risk of damage and costs.
Spend some time doing extra cleaning and thorough inspections usually pays in long run.


I have cut many DPF's open on band saw and to verify cleaning process quality or for where they crack & depending on what is used and how performed.

Reverse back flush works extremely well in car.
I install a block plate by separating the turbo from DPF and then fill the DPF with cleaner to emulsify.
Then I back flush the exhaust with high psi air and distilled water. I catch everything out the OXS port or EGT ports and hook up adapter hoses to collect remediated material to bucket for proper disposal .

I am the ultimate scavenger & will get blood from a stone as long as I know what I'm doing comports with qualified repair or better.

I have seen all to often where someone installs a new DPF to only same problem in short timeline if failed to do properly.

After a good flush I install a bore camera and take a look.
Be sure the ports for air PSI sensors are not plugged, because this can throw off particulate levels as indicated in ECU causing false codes.

Always consider what caused a condition and is your diagnosis the cause or the result.

That's why JPPSG!
 
   #12  

grittysoup

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Hi Jack,

Thanks for your comments, I have done some research, and feel as you do, that a properly cleaned DPF should go on to serve you many more miles.

I am wary at this stage of doing a forced regen, am waiting for a normal regen to occur, I really need to reset the DPF values after cleaning, and make an allowance for the miles driven since cleaning (only a few 100 miles).

I understand the ECU makes a number of calculations based on mileage, driving pattern, and other factors - since last normal regen, I know it recently had a forced regen at the dealers.

Is there anyway in VCDS to see approximately when the next regen is due ??

Seems lots use a chemical, with pressured back flushing to clean ... others bake the DPF at over 1000 deg. - to get rid of the ash, I have also found someone who uses Ultrasonic bath treatment, with flushing - which seems quite interesting, and i would have thought the best approach.

Removing and refitting the DPF from the crafter is not too difficult.

Large commercial vehicles seem to be made for removing and flushing through the DPF, only with water and compressed air, its like regular maintenance.
Maybe there is a physical difference in the make-up of a large commercial DPF that allows that to happen, we know these do many 100,'s of 1000's of miles.
I see there are lots of different types, cordierite, silicon, ceramic etc, is one more expendable than the other.
 
   #13  

Jack@European_Parts

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Default ECU with recode or re-flash and yeah I like ultrasonic cleaning but It's unneeded.
Magical chemicals and water and permitting a bubbler of low psi like a washing machine and go have a coffee and read some news article in paper or net.
People should apply the KISS Method and not over think.
It's just soot!

Clean all of it and every sensor.
 
   #14  

grittysoup

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Clean all of it and every sensor.

I was quite careful not to clean the ends of any of the sensors, should they have had a clean, and what do you recommend should have been used to clean them, white spirit and a toothbrush, or something more aggressive like carbi cleaner ? they looked as you would expect them to - but no unusual amount of build up.
 
   #16  

grittysoup

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I always believed the tips of Lambda sensors and the like were quite sensitive, so you recommend heat and oven cleaner ... not sure where the distilled water comes in, to wash everything off with ?

I guess Oven Cleaner can be used on heavily coked up basic parts such as the inlet manifold, I understand it scarifies the surface of aluminium - which when the part is put back on it just coats in carbon all the quicker, not sure that is a huge issue though, saying that I used it on the EGR valve, that had half turned into a lump of coal. I also used it on the inlet manifold and EGR cooler.

I think on and around the DPF there were 3 or 4 sensors, pressure differential, Lambda and I think some temperature sensors ... it makes perfect sense to clean the sensors - but with oven cleaner ??? :)
 
   #17  

Jack@European_Parts

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Isn't the distilled water to rinse a solvent?

Wouldn't you burn a senor tip & cherry red for 2 minutes min, with a propane torch & to remove impurities since burns clean?


Huh........ what! where?
 
   #18  

grittysoup

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Cleaning a DPF with this mileage is in my opinion not worth it in the long run - especially if the car did a lot of short distance/city drive cycles. However, now that you've done that, you should be able to reset the ash mass to about 10% of it's original value and perform a forced/service regeneration after that. As Uwe already indicated, the MAF issue needs to be resolved first. For once it may be the root cause for your troubles and second it will likely block DPF related diagnostic procedures like the reset or a regeneration. When replacing the DPF at any later date, make sure to get the proper one. Early Crafter models had DPF Generation 2 from factory, but may have had it replaced with Generation 3 accompanied with a software/firmware update. Based on the data you posted, the software/firmware currently used requires a DPF3. Mixing the newer software with an older DPF and vice versa will also result in poor regeneration results and lacking emissions, as well as a failing DPF.

As far as the software/firmware levels go, there is an update to 074-906-032-AN @ 5170 available which changes the emission classification from EURO IV to EU 4 (see TPI 2021119 for details), though from regeneration wise it won't do you much good I believe. Aside from that, there is a special short distance software/firmware available (see TPI 2018140 for details) if you truly need that. I am surprised that the dealers never applied that, due to the mentioned issues.
I have done some trips in the vehicle, city and motorway driving, and the MAF error has not returned, can I assume it was a spurious error ?

If it was, can I move onto resetting the Values for the cleaned DPF, and get the specific instructions and steps for doing so - I have looked online but find nothing specific for this vehicle.

"you should be able to reset the ash mass to about 10% of it's original value "

Without needing to get past any security (which I believe I need to do to make changes) I can read:

91-LT3 Engine, Long Adaptation: 'Carbon Mass (ECM/DPF Replacement)':

Channel 12 reads:
56: Particle Filter Carbon Mass
Stored Value: 5636

Do I want to input '563' then enter that as a 'New Value', and press save ?

"and perform a forced/service regeneration after that."
It has been suggested to not do this, but if I do, should I replace the oil when done >?

I am right to think VW have not programmed in a procedure to reset the values- for a 'cleaned' DPF, as they do not want owners doing so ? - I am quite happy to have mine cleaned as and when.

Thanks.
 
   #19  

grittysoup

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Can anyone answer my above question, ie resetting the ECU for a cleaned DPF, is there a specific procedure I can follow for my vehicle (2008 VW Crafter 2.5 TDI R5).

I want to avoid guessing and doing more harm than good.

Thanks.
 
   #20  

Dana

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Hello Robert,

We received your email and based on the label file instructions:

Carbon Mass (ECM/DPF Replacement)
Engine Speed,(G28)
Particle Filter,Carbon Mass
Consumption since,Regeneration
Distance since,Regeneration

Carbon Mass (ECM/DPF Replacement)
After replacing either the Engine Control Module (ECM) or the Diesel
Particle Filter (DPF) the Oil Ash Volume needs to be adjusted to allow
proper Monitoring and Calculation of the Regeneration.

After Replacing the Diesel Particle Filter (DPF) save "0" as new Value.

After Replacing the Engine Control Module (ECM) the Carbon Mass Value has to be transferred
from the OLD/ORIGINAL Engine Control Module (ECM). If the OLD/ORIGINAL Value is not available
the new Value has to be calculated based on the average Consumption which can be found in the
Instrument Cluster (otherwise assume a value of 7 l/100 km).

Carbon Mass = Mileage (km) * Consumption (liter/100 km) * Ash Coefficient (0.0046 g / liter)
.. you could certainly crunch the actual numbers and enter a reasonable value but I think entering 563 [Test] > [Save] would be far better than entering 0 as if it was new (since it was not replaced).
 
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