Polo 6R MY2011 G250 issue

   #1  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
The car was crashed and repaired before it came to my workshop. Together with a lot of other issues, mainly already solved, I got G250 sensor faulty DTC.
Wiring from PS pump/control module to G250 was damaged in crash and badly repaired. I redid repair and DTC changed from
Code:
00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250) 
            30-00 - Open or Short to Plus
to
Code:
00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250) 
            37-00 - Faulty
Another (used) sensor gives the same fault. Both sensors are Hella made, 6Q0 423 445
Ok, there are couple of simple possibilities: another used sensor is faulty, too; signal input of control module is faulty; etc.
But couple things get me puzzled:
1) GW list in autoscan shows 44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000, but DTC in module 44 is permanent;
2) according WD cable 6Q1 901 129 pinout is #1 to #1, #2 to #2 and #3 to #3. In reality pin #1 goes to pin #3 and vice versa. Cable was damaged in the middle and connected back by colors of wires. The only WD showing pin numbers in both ends is for Polo 6R, all other WD's of models using the same 6Q1 901 129 cable shows numbering only in one end. Do anyone have that type of car or separate cable handy and is willing to help me with pinout?
Autoscan:
Code:
Tuesday,26,February,2019,01:29:26:32442
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows XP x86
VCDS Version: 18.9.1.0
Data version: 20190114 DS296.0
www.Ross-Tech.com

Workshop Code: 123 12345 012345

VIN: WVWZZZ6RZBY233699   License Plate: 


Chassis Type: 6R-VW25 (6N0)
Scan: 01 03 08 09 15 17 19 25 44 56

VIN: WVWZZZ6RZBY233699   Mileage: 178630km-110995miles

01-Engine -- Status: OK 0000
03-ABS Brakes -- Status: Malfunction 0010
08-Auto HVAC -- Status: OK 0000
09-Cent. Elect. -- Status: Malfunction 0010
15-Airbags -- Status: OK 0000
17-Instruments -- Status: Malfunction 0010
19-CAN Gateway -- Status: OK 0000
25-Immobilizer -- Status: OK 0000
44-Steering Assist -- Status: OK 0000
56-Radio -- Status: OK 0000
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine (J0000-CFWA)       Labels:. 03P-906-021-CFW.clb
   Part No SW: 03P 906 021     HW: 03P 907 425 A
   Component: R3 1.2 DCM3.7 H06 8410  
   Revision: 11002001    Serial number:               
   Coding: 00114014002400080000
   Shop #: WSC 12345 123 12345
   ASAM Dataset: EV_ECM12TDI03103P906021 001010
   ROD: EV_ECM12TDI03103P906021.rod
   VCID: 65C1DBAB641F7C624E-8030

No fault code found.
Readiness: 1110 1000

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes (J104)       Labels: 6R0-907-37x-ABS82.clb
   Part No SW: 6R0 907 379 AE    HW: 6R0 907 379 AC
   Component: ABS8.2 front  H04 0001  
   Revision: --------    
   Coding: 200224E3017000B5042B24EB80DA00000200
   Shop #: WSC 00788 648 00255
   VCID: 0109EF3B9C77B042D2-8054

1 Fault Found:
02214 - Tire Pressure Warning 
            002 - Lower Limit Exceeded
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 01100010
                    Fault Priority: 0
                    Fault Frequency: 31
                    Reset counter: 84
                    Mileage: 178614 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2013.07.15
                    Time: 13:45:41

             Freeze Frame:
                    Hex Value: 0x0000
                    Hex Value: 0x0000
                    Hex Value: 0x3203
                    Hex Value: 0x1997
                    Hex Value: 0x00FF
                    Hex Value: 0x007F
                    Hex Value: 0x7E00
                    Hex Value: 0x0000


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC (J301)       Labels: None
   Part No SW: 6R0 820 045 F    HW: 6R0 820 045 F
   Component: Man AC         02 0101  
   Revision: 0002S 02    
   VCID: 31697FFB6857E0C262-8064

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect. (J519)       Labels:. 6R0-937-08x-09.clb
   Part No SW: 6R0 937 087 H    HW: 6R0 937 087 
   Component: BCM PQ25 H+4  H46 0230  
   Revision: BF046001    Serial number: 0394 038111723
   Coding: 3CB029BF08A10000002008003D2B0CD00088410F60060000200000000000
   Shop #: WSC 124697 483 00190
   VCID: 428B2037DDF16B5A8B-8016

   Subsystem 1 - Part No SW: 6R0 959 801 AB    HW: 6R0 959 801 AB  Labels: 6R0-959-801.CLB
   Component: J386__TSG_FT  007 1621 
   Serial number: KU0-KU024.01.1114910
   Coding: 08BC30

   Subsystem 2 - Part No SW: 6R0 959 802 AD    HW: 6R0 959 802 AD  Labels: 6R0-959-802.CLB
   Component: J387__TSG_BT  007 1621 
   Serial number: KU0-KU026.01.1115823
   Coding: 08BC30

1 Fault Found:
00920 - Heated Outside Mirrors; Driver Side (Z4) / Passenger Side (Z5) 
            011 - Open Circuit - Intermittent
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00101011
                    Fault Priority: 3
                    Fault Frequency: 10
                    Reset counter: 124
                    Mileage: 178602 km
                    Time Indication: 0
                    Date: 2013.07.14
                    Time: 10:16:53


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags (J234)       Labels:| 5K0-959-655.clb
   Part No SW: 6R0 959 655 K    HW: 6R0 959 655 K
   Component: VW10Airbag01K H09 0020  
   Revision: --------    Serial number: 003GX00F6RR+
   Coding: 00314B
   Shop #: WSC 00788 648 00255
   ASAM Dataset: EV_AirbaVW10BPAVW250 A01001
   ROD: EV_AirbaVW10BPAVW250.rod
   VCID: 4A9B0817EDC1B31A43-801E

   Crash sensor for side airbag: driver side: 
   Serial number: 3575HRB40630ATOCBP3U

   Crash sensor for side airbag: front passenger side: 
   Serial number: 3585HRB405P0DGESFH86

   Crash sensor for side airbag: rear: driver side: 
   Serial number: 3515RRB405V0DD2AB0UQ

   Crash sensor for side airbag: rear: passenger side: 
   Serial number: 3525RRB405T0DD2A4H05

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments (J285)       Labels:| 5K0-920-xxx-17.clb-SRI1
   Part No SW: 6R0 920 861 E    HW: 6R0 920 861 E
   Component: KOMBI         H05 0114  
   Serial number: 00000004569723
   Coding: 140800
   Shop #: WSC 00788 648 00255
   ASAM Dataset: EV_DashBoardUDSJCIPQ25 A01013
   ROD: EV_DashBoardUDSJCIPQ25_A01_VW25.rod
   VCID: 377D41E38E333EF22C-8062

1 Fault Found:
10485833 - Internal Control Module Memory Check Sum Error 
          B2000 49 [137] - Internal electronic failure
          [New feature! Extended UDS fault detail is only supported by current gen. interfaces]
          MIL ON - Confirmed - Tested Since Memory Clear
             Freeze Frame:
                    Fault Status: 00000001
                    Fault Priority: 2
                    Fault Frequency: 1
                    Mileage: 117658 km
                    Date: 2017.01.11
                    Time: 11:45:14


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway (J533)       Labels:. 6N0-909-901-6R.clb
   Part No SW: 6N0 909 901     HW: 6R0 937 087 
   Component: GW-K-CAN TP20 0230  
   Coding: 002000
   Shop #: WSC 124697 483 00190
   VCID: 70EFBAFFA3DDA9CA2D-8024

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 25: Immobilizer (J285)       Labels:. 5K0-920-xxx-25.clb
   Part No SW: 6R0 920 861 E    HW: 6R0 920 861 E
   Component: IMMO          H05 0012  
   Serial number:               
   ASAM Dataset: EV_ImmobUDSJCIPQ25 A01001
   ROD: EV_ImmobUDSJCIPQ25.rod
   VCID: 377D41E38E333EF22C-8062

No fault code found.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 6Q0-423-156.clb
   Part No: 6Q0 423 156 G
   Component: Lenkhilfe           0004  
   Coding: 00110
   Shop #: WSC 12345  
   VCID: 336575F3064BD2D210-8066

1 Fault Found:
00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250) 
            37-00 - Faulty

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 56: Radio (J503)       Labels:. 5M0-035-1xx-56.clb
   Part No SW: 5M0 035 156 C    HW: 5M0 035 156 C
   Component: Radio         H30 0072  
   Revision: R0000000    Serial number: VWZAZ1L0550340
   Coding: 0000020002
   Shop #: WSC 00788 648 00255
   VCID: 2959979B40879802AA-807C

No fault code found.

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 01:58)--------------------------
BTW label file 6Q0-423-156.clb in coding help pop-up has x??xx descriptions/values interchanged.
 
   #2  

iichel

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
2,281
Reaction score
2,714
Location
Eindhoven, NB, NL
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=284912
Are you sure the power steering pump itself is ok? Perhaps coding 01210 for the power steering pump. But I doubt this as soon as I wrote it.
 
   #3  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
As I noted just after autoscan there is error in label file coding helper pop-up. x??xx value 12 is for external g85, signal via CAN, value 01 is for integrated G250. Descriptions for those values are interchanged.
Mainly I am asking just for someone to check pin numbering for cable 6Q1 901 129, both ends.
 
   #4  

iichel

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
2,281
Reaction score
2,714
Location
Eindhoven, NB, NL
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=284912
Steering sensor to pump
1 to 1 (black)
2 to 2 (brown)
3 to 3 (green)
 
   #5  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
Is this from elsa or measured from real cable?
 
   #6  

iichel

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
2,281
Reaction score
2,714
Location
Eindhoven, NB, NL
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=284912
It's from Elsa
 
   #7  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
I have the same WD but on real cable are 1 to 3 and 3 to 1. I'd like to compare with another cable with the same partnumber.
 
   #8  

iichel

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
2,281
Reaction score
2,714
Location
Eindhoven, NB, NL
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=284912
Why not switch 1 and 3? See if it solves the problem?
 
   #9  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
I tried it with original pump and G250. When connected according wire colors from damaged cable, fault is
Code:
00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250) 
            37-00 - Faulty
When connected according WD, fault is
Code:
00816 - Power Steering Sensor (G250) 
            30-00 - Open or Short to Plus
just like when wires was broken. I'm not sure if interchanging +12 supply to G250 with PWM signal from G250 is a good idea. Don't know do the input/output circuits inside G250 and J500 have any kind of protection... I already have one possibly bad pump/J500 module and two possibly bad G250 sensors. Don't want more bad ones and will not try swap pins before receiving info what are connections of real undamaged/unrepaired original cable.

P.S. Last couple years I work for a dealer (unfortunately not for a VAG dealer) and I have seen a lot of errors in original wiring diagrams and other technical documentation, so I don't trust WD just because it is from ERWIN or ELSA.
 
   #10  

Dana

Administrator
Staff member
Ross-Tech Employee
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
4,472
Reaction score
6,586
Location
Western PA, USA
As I noted just after autoscan there is error in label file coding helper pop-up. x??xx value 12 is for external g85, signal via CAN, value 01 is for integrated G250. Descriptions for those values are interchanged.

I don't have hands-on experience with those systems to offer but I can discuss the label descriptions with a larger group next week. At a quick glance we have:

German lbl:
01 = Geber für Lenkwinkel ist Teil der Bremsenelektronik (für ALLE Bosch 5.7)
01 = Geber für Lenkwinkel NICHT verbaut (für ABS Bosch 8.0/8.2i)
12 = Geber für Lenkwinkel ist Teil der Lenkhilfe (für ASR bzw. ASR/ESP Bosch 8.0/8.2i)

English VCDS lbl:
01 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the ABS/ESP (for Bosch 5.7 Brake Electronics)
12 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the Steering Aid (for Bosch 8.0/8.2i Brake Electronics)

Do you feel as though adding the 2nd possibility for 01 to English VCDS would resolve the noted conflict -or- am I off track here?

P.S. I agree with incorrect wiring diagrams. I encountered that yesterday with a G40 wire to the ECM on a 2013 GLI 2.0T gas and had to use an incorrect diagram (from a 2010 GTI) to sort it.
 
   #11  

Jack@European_Parts

Gone But Not Forgotten
Joined
Jan 29, 2014
Messages
21,923
Reaction score
9,257
Location
Montgomery, NY, USA
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=57337
Fake out LIN with resistance value or sensor and PSI sensor with variable value to see if you get a wake to vacate the DTC for testing.
 
   #12  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
Solved. Another pump/J500 module fitted, coded and fault is gone.
BTW there is error in Elsa/ErWin diagram.
 
   #13  

MartinsX

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Sep 5, 2016
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
1,244
Location
Riga, Latvia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=268515
I don't have hands-on experience with those systems to offer but I can discuss the label descriptions with a larger group next week. At a quick glance we have:

German lbl:
01 = Geber für Lenkwinkel ist Teil der Bremsenelektronik (für ALLE Bosch 5.7)
01 = Geber für Lenkwinkel NICHT verbaut (für ABS Bosch 8.0/8.2i)
12 = Geber für Lenkwinkel ist Teil der Lenkhilfe (für ASR bzw. ASR/ESP Bosch 8.0/8.2i)

English VCDS lbl:
01 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the ABS/ESP (for Bosch 5.7 Brake Electronics)
12 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the Steering Aid (for Bosch 8.0/8.2i Brake Electronics)

Do you feel as though adding the 2nd possibility for 01 to English VCDS would resolve the noted conflict -or- am I off track here?

P.S. I agree with incorrect wiring diagrams. I encountered that yesterday with a G40 wire to the ECM on a 2013 GLI 2.0T gas and had to use an incorrect diagram (from a 2010 GTI) to sort it.

I haven't tested changing coding for car with electric steering pump in combination with Bosch 5.7 just for investigation, so I can't comment it at this time. I didn't pay attention to coding descriptions before, mainly just copy/paste coding from old unit, when replacing one.
I think, label file should be:
Code:
12 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the ABS/ESP (for Bosch 5.7 Brake Electronics)
01 = Steering Angle Sensor is Part of the Steering Aid (for Bosch 8.0/8.2i Brake Electronics)
 
   #14  

golfi_vend

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Apr 9, 2014
Messages
2,174
Reaction score
2,088
Location
Tartu, Estonia
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=195131
I haven't checked this case, but on older Fabia and Polo there are 2 manufactures for power steering pump. Isn't that between those wiring may be different?
 
   #15  

iichel

Verified VCDS User
Verified
Joined
Aug 10, 2016
Messages
2,281
Reaction score
2,714
Location
Eindhoven, NB, NL
VCDS Serial number
C?ID=284912
In the Polo 6R, all pumps are made by TRW. In the 6Q (9N/3) generation, manufacturers were indeed TRW or KOYO.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Uwe
Top