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Uwe

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Will they sell?
It will be tough for Lamborghini to develop cars that will comply with all the 'anti-gas' regulations coming into force over the coming decades without the backing of a major automotive company such as VW, so IMHO it depends if Piech could negotiate a technology sharing agreement as part of the purchase.
 
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Uwe

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Lamborghini hat im vergangenen Jahr 7.430 teure SUV und Sportwagen verkauft, 1,6 Milliarden Euro erlöst. Die Marke leiste einen "wichtigen Beitrag zur Profitabilität" von Audi

Translation:
In the past year, Lamborghini sold 7,430 expensive SUVs and sports cars, releasing 1.6 billion Euros. The brand performed an "important contribution to the profitability" of Audi

Doing some quick arithmetic: 1.6 billion Euros divided by 7,430 vehicles equals ~215,000 Euros of profit per unit vehicle. This seems implausibly high considering that their bread-and-butter models, the Urus and Huracan can both be had in the $200k range brand new..?

-Uwe-
 

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I don't know where all this is going to end up!! Over the pond here in the UK our "do-gooders", that'll be the white collar workers (government) with NO experience at all are saying that all petrol and diesel vehicles are being banned from sale in 2030!! If I'm correct with this date and it officially goes ahead then the manufacturers will most certainly tool down and tool up for full electric vehicles. Now although vehicles will always be around in our working life time, I'm thinking parts supplies will dwindle out and then vehicles will become none repairable. Yes I've already seen this with some cheaper end vehicles where a dealer had stopped supply clutch hydraulic pipes. Now your HV electrical vehicles being pushed into the market are already starting to fail in a very dangerous way. One recent electrical vehicle I looked at had serious water ingress into the boot area which made its way onto the high voltage batteries, thus total short circuit, but luckily no fire problems. Another vehicle I'd researched and repaired last month was a Ford whereby the KVM and IPC were advising a keyless entry fault. The customer advised the engine would intermittently start and sometimes cut out, and on one particular experience she had the ESCLM activated the steering lock while she was driving and she panicked when the steering could not be turned. My investigations, tests and research to this Ford concluded that the main central processor that decides when to pass information onto other electrical control units was badly designed such that when that processor itself was the failing item, that no backup was in place to ensure the vehicle would fail safely. Reporting this back to Ford took some time before they replied, and reading what they wrote back basically was saying, "We're not interested". When flyby wire brakes and steering hit the market properly in everyday cars and the main processor fails like in this ford, then the passengers are dead, end of. Vehicles are not designed properly, they are basically expensive junk that is totally dangerous when electrical systems fail.
 

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Just a little update on the last post with another real example of the safety of electric cars...


Maybe its time to start thinking about back-pedaling and stick with that what we know is safe??
 

Uwe

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Maybe its time to start thinking about back-pedaling and stick with that what we know is safe??
I don't accept the notion that a tank full of petrol or even diesel is "safer" than a battery. Check the stats on how many dead-dinosaur powered cars catch on fire and burn to the ground every year. It happens so often that it generally not even considered newsworthy.

-Uwe-
 

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I don't accept the notion that a tank full of petrol or even diesel is "safer" than a battery. Check the stats on how many dead-dinosaur powered cars catch on fire and burn to the ground every year. It happens so often that it generally not even considered newsworthy.

From that same news site, a major bridge is closed for up to a week because of a diesel fuel spill:

https://www.cheshire-live.co.uk/new...ws/silver-jubilee-bridge-closed-week-20710897

Back in December also in Cheshire:

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/13490494/supercars-destroyed-suspected-arson-attack/

I can't believe that people want to drive around with HYDROGEN tanks in cars. Oh, the humanity!!!!! :rolleyes:

hindenburg-1-1.jpg
 

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I don't accept the notion that a tank full of petrol or even diesel is "safer" than a battery. Check the stats on how many dead-dinosaur powered cars catch on fire and burn to the ground every year. It happens so often that it generally not even considered newsworthy.

-Uwe-
None of us have the proper experience todate with electric cars and the tip of the iceburg is only just showing itself. When the batteries age a bit and the cases starting showing problems that's when we might see real problems? When hydrogen cars are on the road then its definitely time to get off the road. I don't believe anything being made today is safe for the longer term.

Here in the UK back in 2003 we graduate students were discussing the implications of washing machines and cutting costs in the manufacture of them. (Why engineers were even discussing that is beyond me) I was the only graduate there that could see they would be a fire hazard in the near future. The Phd shrugged me off implying I did not understand what I was talking about. A few years later the news reported kitchen fires and flooded houses due to failed washing machines.

There is a very good saying, you can't buy or be given understanding, and that what one might think they understand does not necessarily mean their understanding is correct. there is no substitute for real experience and understanding, and books/journals won't supply it.
 

Uwe

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None of us have the proper experience todate with electric cars
We do have the better part of two decades experience with Li-Ion batteries in other applications; the same basic tech has been in in every portable electronic device from laptops to cell phones for that long. Do you worry about them catching fire? Then there's cordless power tools. Li-ion displaced nickel-based batteries in those applications more than 10 years ago, when "high drain" cells became available. And of course we've had Teslas and Nissan Leafs on the road for more than 10 years as well. Are they more of a fire hazard than petrol or diesel powered cars? The actual statistics don't indicate that they are, but for some reason, every time there's a car fire in an electric car, it makes national, front page news, while nobody bats an eyelash when it happens to a conventional car.
the implications of washing machines and cutting costs in the manufacture of them.
Yes, that's a problem everywhere. Engineers want to build the best products they can; that's just the way engineers are. However, building the best product you can is never cheap, and consumers seem to want feature-rich products at the lowest price possible. Company management wants products that consumers will buy -- and that they will have to replace at some point foreseeable future, because selling them a product that will last many decades or even a lifetime means little repeat business. Thus engineers are pressured to reduce manufacturing costs. This has caused something of a race to the bottom in nearly all industries that make things for consumers, and engineers hate it.

-Uwe-
 

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We do have the better part of two decades experience with Li-Ion batteries in other applications.

Yes, that's a problem everywhere. Engineers want to build the best products they can; that's just the way engineers are. However, building the best product you can is never cheap, and consumers seem to want feature-rich products at the lowest price possible. Company management wants products that consumers will buy -- and that they will have to replace at some point foreseeable future, because selling them a product that will last many decades or even a lifetime means little repeat business. Thus engineers are pressured to reduce manufacturing costs. This has caused something of a race to the bottom in nearly all industries that make things for consumers, and engineers hate it.

-Uwe-
I see where you are coming from but there is a big difference between holding a tool in your hand with Li-Ion batteries and a car floor panel full of them when they let go. Now when that car becomes a none self driven car, in other words fully autonomous, then when electrics fail the passengers will not be in control, therefore will they be able to jump out the car before they choke to death!

Over here in the UK now our government have changed the law with regards our domestic products like washing machines, dryers etc. The government have said that the built quality and reliability must significantly be improved and they must be safe, and genuine parts must be made available to repair them outside of any warranty period.

What our government have just done there basically is agreed with what I pointed out to the Phd's back in 2003 when they disagreed with me.

Now I've just purchased a new washing machine and it actually came with a ten year warranty for about £300. Personally if the machine malfunctioned after about five years like my last one just did, then I'd just buy another at those prices. Delivery in the UK even with COVID is very efficient these days.
 

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How many write cycles can the flash in a Bosch ECU endure?

Now, when they arm the police with a *roadside* OBD box to check for altered firmware...
...the next question is how quickly you can re-flash a Bosch ECU before the nice occifer plugs in the firmware verifier.....
 

Uwe

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Now, when they arm the police with a *roadside* OBD box to check for altered firmware...
I do not think that's likely to happen in the foreseeable future. They're talking about failing cars during the biennial emissions test, and flashing an ECU back to stock every two years strikes me as unlikely to exceed the write cycles that the flash can endure.

-Uwe-
 

Uwe

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i wonder what would happen if your obd port "accidently" fried their roadside testing equipment? 😈
Ooohh.. Anyone got an old ignition coil laying around? :D

-Uwe-
 
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