EXTRA EXTRA READ ALL ABOUT IT GENERAL NEWS THREAD ANYTHING GOES!

   #762  

Uwe

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Yay!
https://www.ttnews.com/articles/car...nox-technically-achievable-and-cost-effective
CARB Staff White Paper: Significant Reductions in NOx ‘Technically Achievable and Cost-Effective’ for MY 2024 Heavy Trucks
For the last three decades, NOx and PM emission standards for heavy-duty on-road engines have become more stringent. For NOx, the standard has decreased from 6.0 grams per brake horsepower hour in 1990 to the current 0.20 grams per brake horsepower hour standard in 2010. For PM, the standard has decreased from 0.6 g/bhp-hr in 1990 to 0.01 g/bhp-hr in 2010.
So they've already reduced NOx emissions by a factor of 30, and PM emissions by a factor of 600. Will they ever get to the point of saying, "That's good enough"?

-Uwe-
 
   #763  

Jack@European_Parts

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So they've already reduced NOx emissions by a factor of 30, and PM emissions by a factor of 600. Will they ever get to the point of saying, "That's good enough"?

-Uwe-
Shouldn't we at least always try to innovate and do better if possible?:rolleyes:
 
   #764  

Uwe

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Shouldn't we at least always try to innovate and do better if possible?:rolleyes:
At what cost?

I'm sure you're familiar with the concept of diminishing returns. Somehow, we all survived 30 times as much NOx and 600 times as much PM coming from trucks in the past. Was it worth it to clean them up to the current level? I think so. I do remember how nasty big trucks were once upon a time. But I'd like to see some evidence / justification that it's worthwhile to reduce this stuff a whole bunch more, especially since we all know that these kinds of reductions are directly at odds with increasing fuel efficiency.

-Uwe-
 
   #766  

Jack@European_Parts

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At what cost?

I'm sure you're familiar with the concept of diminishing returns. Somehow, we all survived 30 times as much NOx and 600 times as much PM coming from trucks in the past. Was it worth it to clean them up to the current level? I think so. I do remember how nasty big trucks were once upon a time. But I'd like to see some evidence / justification that it's worthwhile to reduce this stuff a whole bunch more, especially since we all know that these kinds of reductions are directly at odds with increasing fuel efficiency.

-Uwe-
Well sure but I'm saying innovation and research are important and as for cost, really we are not talking about technology that really increases the cars cost that much & especially when in comparison to accouterments that are unneeded.
 
   #767  

Uwe

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Paywalled. But here's another article on this bill:
https://www.investopedia.com/secure-act-4688468
I don't see this as "Congress coming for my IRA".

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/07/09/the-secure-act-reduces-incentive-to-reinvest-401k-withdrawals.html
Nor here. What exactly is the problem with delaying the age at which people who don't need the money have to take distributions? Whether it makes sense to do that or not depends on individual circumstances. I'm sure there are hypoethical scenarios under which it's advantageous to do so, and others under which it's not. Seems like this is giving people more flexibility. I see that as A Good Thing.

-Uwe-
 
   #771  

PetrolDave

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It's not the turbo self-destructing I would be worrying about - but the effect on the engine of the broken bits of turbo when ingested by the engine :facepalm:
 
   #772  

Jack@European_Parts

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It's not the turbo self-destructing I would be worrying about - but the effect on the engine of the broken bits of turbo when ingested by the engine :facepalm:
I install catch screens in my race engines & because I found they actually create a TQ benefit in some cases & depending on where placed and a safety mechanism, I do the same in gas and diesel HPP fuel lines to injectors!

Still wouldn't use that turbo though...........
 
   #773  

Jack@European_Parts

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https://20somethingfinance.com/obama-new-fuel-economy-standards-for-2025/

U.S. Fuel Economy Standards: 54.5 MPG by 2025


Vehicle Technologies to Improve Fuel Economy and Reduce GHGsNHTSA’s and EPA’s technology assessment indicates there is a wide range of technologies available formanufacturers to consider in improving fuel economy and reducing GHG emissions. The standards allowfor long-term planning by manufacturers and suppliers for the continued development and deploymentacross their fleets of fuel saving and emissions-reducing technologies. The agencies believe thatadvances in gasoline engines and transmissions will continue for the foreseeable future, and that there willbe continual improvement in other technologies, including vehicle weight reduction, lower tire rollingresistance, improvements in vehicle aerodynamics, diesel engines, and more efficient vehicle accessories,and that vehicle air conditioners will continue to improve by becoming more efficient. The agencies alsoexpect to see some increased electrification of the fleet through the expanded production of stop/start,hybrid, plug-in hybrid electric and electric vehicles, as well as other alternative fuel vehicles like naturalgas. Many of these technologies are already available today, and the agency expects manufacturers willbe able to meet the standards through further improvements in these technologies, as well as through asignificant penetration of these and other technologies across the fleet.

Air Conditioning and Off-Cycle-Related Fuel Consumption Improvement Values - For thefirst time for MYs 2017-2025, manufacturers will be able to generate fuel consumption improvementvalues for improvements in air conditioning (A/C) system efficiency to use in complying with the CAFEstandards, and for real-world improvements through the use of “off-cycle” technologies that raise fueleconomy in ways that are not reflected on the current test procedures. Such technologies might includesolar panels, engine start-stop, or active aerodynamics. These flexibilities will be implemented in theCAFE program in the same way that they are implemented in EPA’s GHG program. Manufacturers whoemploy off-cycle technologies may be eligible for pre-defined improvement values from an “off-cyclemenu,” or may petition the agencies to obtain a higher value or for technologies not on the menu.Manufacturers may only raise their CAFE levels up to a certain amount using off-cycle menutechnologies.

https://www.nhtsa.gov/staticfiles/rulemaking/pdf/cafe/CAFE_2017-25_Fact_Sheet.pdf
 
   #774  

Uwe

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Manufacturers who employ off-cycle technologies may be eligible for pre-defined improvement values from an “off-cycle menu,” or may petition the agencies to obtain a higher value or for technologies not on the menu.Manufacturers may only raise their CAFE levels up to a certain amount using off-cycle menu technologies.
Sounds like they're going to pretend that these cars get better mileage than they actually do. :)

-Uwe-
 
   #775  

Jack@European_Parts

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Sounds like they're going to pretend that these cars get better mileage than they actually do.


-Uwe-

Well I want to go back to the days of no responsibility, woods riding my CR and pretend land too!

Kids now have some life in comparison to working the fields on the farm huh?

 
   #778  

Jack@European_Parts

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We are indeed aligned on many views , this is one of them.

I post many things just to check if I am crazy or if someone can make a good argument.
 
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