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   #122  

Shaun

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Oops, as jyoung just pointed out to me, FW V0.210 has been out for a bit and I forgot to update this thread. It has a fix for USB issues with certain hubs.
--Shaun
 
   #123  

jakematic

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Will the WhyFI utility update functionality for ROD files be folded into the web interface at some point ?
 
   #124  

Uwe

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   #126  

Uwe

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Yeah, but RODs ain't one of those abilities that only the utility has. ;)
 
   #127  

jakematic

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Yeah, but RODs ain't one of those abilities that only the utility has. ;)
I mean whatever it does other than configuring WhyFi....

"Hey here's an awesome wireless tool! Now go plug it into a computer to update it..." :eek:
 
   #128  

Uwe

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Well, it's kinda like a cell-phone or cordless phone -- it's wireless -- until it's time to recharge it. ;)

In principle, I think it's possible to update everything via WiFi. The question is, whether it's a good idea to do so.

-Uwe-
 
   #129  

jakematic

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Well... I view the utility as training wheels for the folks who aren't as adept at configuring things as guys like Jason and I and likely others.
I never use it except for capturing screenshots to help here in the forum and downloaded out of curiosity when the Mac version was posted.

The idea that we have to be shackled to it regardless doesn't make sense to me.
Curious as to what others think.

iOS and Android let you update OTA so charging is not a valid argument :p
 
   #130  

Uwe

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iOS and Android let you update OTA so charging is not a valid argument :p
Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't OTA updates introduced with iOS 5? :)
 
   #131  

jakematic

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't OTA updates introduced with iOS 5? :)
Not certain - I'm a developer and we do things differently.
And don't name our code after candy :p
And aren't shackled to carriers and vendors 'approving' and fiddling with the code only to be available through their channels :p :p

But I digress... this is a discussion of the HN, not telephones.
 
   #132  

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Well... I view the utility as training wheels for the folks who aren't as adept at configuring things as guys like Jason and I and likely others.

...

The idea that we have to be shackled to it regardless doesn't make sense to me.
The vision we've heard so far is this: you should be able to pick up HEX-NET and $RANDOM_HTTP_CLIENT, and just go. It's a good vision.

I'm guessing the USB utility will become less relevant over time. There are still chicken-and-egg problems wherein you need a bugfix to get online or to upgrade OTA, but you can't get online or OTA upgrade to get the necessary fix. It's a necessary evil for the time being, and even after it's cleared up for the daily users, there will be units in the field that get pulled out of a drawer twice a year that will be running very old stuff.

I had thought ROD files were delivered as a "dataset" (DS) update OTA, but I don't own any UDS cars, so I don't run up against that stuff very often.

Jason
 
   #133  

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I concur Jason.

At some point I'd like to be able to just leave the HEX-NET in the vehicle instead of bringing it back to my desk after every trip :D
I realize it's still Beta, but.... poke poke.... poke poke...
 
   #134  

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At some point I'd like to be able to just leave the HEX-NET in the vehicle instead of bringing it back to my desk after every trip :D
I realize it's still Beta, but.... poke poke.... poke poke...
I can't disagree. I rather suspect it's the main reason, if not the only reason Uwe hasn't taken off the Beta label. It's been more than two months since I could make Desktop/HN break in any meaningful way once HN is online. I only have older and simpler vehicles, but I haven't seen much of any vehicle-related grumbling in the Beta forum. It's all been about the process of getting online.

Right now there's a Mobile WiFi config bug that forces you to use the Java utility to connect to infrastructure networks using WPA/WPA2, but it looks like that was sorted already in an upcoming release. As for upgrades, that's been quirky all along. I don't know what the story is. It seems like downloading and untarring files shouldn't be that hard. However, I know there's a lot of IP protection stuff wrapped around it, and I'm sure that makes it complicated. Seems like China screws you either way. :(

Jason
 
   #135  

jakematic

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Well I for one am glad that R-T is protecting their IP and jumping way ahead of the pack with the HN.

What would be cool is if the WhyFi assisted setup could be done from the apps if all that java garbage [garbage = java sucks donkey sphincter in all ways] was embedded on the HN.
Then again I know what it's like being a developer and having facepalm moments for various reasons :D

It will get there, I know.
 
   #136  

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What would be cool is if the WhyFi assisted setup could be done from the apps if all that java garbage [garbage = java sucks donkey sphincter in all ways] was embedded on the HN.
Jake, I think it's all embedded, or intended to be. WiFi config and OTA software updates can be done in the Mobile UI. It's just sometimes that part is NFG. :)

There are some boot and crypto components you see in the USB utility that we've never seen OTA pushes for, but I am given to understand they're not fast-moving targets. I may be missing something re: those ROD updates you mentioned, but I thought those were included in OTA dataset updates.

Jason
 
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   #137  

jakematic

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I may be missing something re: those ROD updates you mentioned, but I thought those were included in OTA dataset updates.
Allegedly they are, and got updated in the last major fixpack when we had to check for updates 6 or 7 times. [Remind you of Windoze XP with 47 reboots on patch Tuesdays?]
Then..... there are more that the HN didn't know about but the utility did.

It's forking update methodologies and is a bad idea IMHO, but then again I've only been programming for 37 years....
Now I'm an Architect so the programmers, implementation guys, and everyone in development hates me equally for understanding the end user process :rolleyes:

Am just trying to add my 2 inflation adjusted cent input to make a better product.
 
   #138  

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Allegedly they are, and got updated in the last major fixpack when we had to check for updates 6 or 7 times. [Remind you of Windoze XP with 47 reboots on patch Tuesdays?]
With Beta programs come frequent updates. :) That one big push with the WiFi radio firmware update was probably a major outlier though.

It's forking update methodologies and is a bad idea IMHO, but then again I've only been programming for 37 years....
Now I'm an Architect so the programmers, implementation guys, and everyone in development hates me equally for understanding the end user process :rolleyes:
From a network perspective, I think it chitchats with the same back-end servers using the same protocols to discover and obtain updates. From a device perspective, I imagine it uses the same dev/test and manufacturing load interfaces that have to exist anyway. I doubt there was a total re-invention of the wheel. From a UX perspective, I stipulate that training on two different methods isn't ideal, but once the Mobile UI config and OTA update mechanisms are smoothed out, I don't see why people would use the USB utility except as a fallback or rescue mechanism.

Am just trying to add my 2 inflation adjusted cent input to make a better product.
And I should probably stop putting words in Uwe's mouth :o so I'll let him carry on/correct the record from here if he wishes.

Jason
 
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   #139  

Uwe

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That's pretty spot-on, Jason.

And yes, it would all be a lot simpler if we didn't have to worry about security.

-Uwe-
 
   #140  

jakematic

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once the Mobile UI config and OTA update mechanisms are smoothed out, I don't see why people would use the USB utility except as a fallback or rescue mechanism.
That's what I'm hoping for :D
Divergence bad, function good.

In the interim I can trust my HUC, which stays in the vehicle.


Edit: I don't mean to disparage the development or Alpha teams, but wasting cycles on tertiary methods aren't wise - I've seen it far too many times.
 
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