Question: How to check the status of Water pump and theromstat?

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Hi Everyone,

My 2004 phaeton V8 Coolant temp is going above 90C (200F) after driving 5 miles. I suspect that the thermostat has failed and not opening when the temp reaches 90C. but I would like to confirm it using the VCDS. it might be water pump or something else. What steps do I need to in the VCDS options?

Asad
 
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Uwe

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An important point: VCDS can only show you what the car knows. The car knows its coolant temperature. But it doesn't have a sensor to measure the speed of the water pump's impeller or the position of the thermostat.

-Uwe-
 
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My 2004 phaeton V8 Coolant temp is going above 90C (200F) after driving 5 miles. I suspect that the thermostat has failed and not opening when the temp reaches 90C. but I would like to confirm it using the VCDS. it might be water pump or something else. What steps do I need to in the VCDS options?
The Phaeton V8 has two coolant temperature sensors. I believe one is on the inner coolant loop, and one is on the radiator egress back toward the engine. Both can be monitored with VCDS. The trouble is, even if you see a substantial difference between them, it just tells you there's a coolant flow problem. It doesn't tell you why. You could still have a failed water pump, a stuck-closed thermostat, a clogged radiator or even just low coolant.

A clogged radiator on a Phaeton doesn't seem very likely. What sort of mileage do you have on this car? If it's ready for a timing belt service, go ahead and do that. Doing a TB job on a Phaeton V8 exposes both the water pump and the thermostat for easy service, and the parts are cheap. Usually your dealer or mechanic will recommend replacing both at the same time you replace the timing belt, and that is a very good idea.

Jason
 
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Thanks Uwe and Jason for the reply.

The Phaeton V8 has two coolant temperature sensors. I believe one is on the inner coolant loop, and one is on the radiator egress back toward the engine. Both can be monitored with VCDS

I enabled all the temperature sensor that i could find in the 01-Engine controller. They didn't have specific names so I couldn't tell if it is inner or outer sensor. all the 3 temp readings were equal in the rise with no difference. does this mean any thing for troubleshooting thermostat or water pump. Here is the picture to explain it better with other readings.

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I don't know why the pic is not showing. its jpg format. do I need to look into my ross-tech profile?

What sort of mileage do you have on this car?

Mileage: 78120km(48541miles). I don't mind doing the timing belt with it and all the other related cooling parts (thermostat, water pump, gasket, seals, tensioner). but it would be helpful to know for sure what the faulty part is?

What are you opinion about blauparts for the timing belt kit ? are they reliable for phaetons ?

Asad
 
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What are you opinion about blauparts for the timing belt kit ? are they reliable for phaetons ?

Hi Asad-

I can't speak to the Phaeton, but know of several of those belts failing on the A8 D2 and D3 on AudiWorld.
No idea if it's the belt supplier or age but proceed with caution when using any non-OEM part from any supplier.

-Jake
 
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I enabled all the temperature sensor that i could find in the 01-Engine controller. They didn't have specific names so I couldn't tell if it is inner or outer sensor. all the 3 temp readings were equal in the rise with no difference. does this mean any thing for troubleshooting thermostat or water pump.
Without an Auto-Scan, I'm making an educated guess based on North American V8 Phaetons. Can you post one? In the meantime, try MVB location 134-4, shown as engine output temperature... I think that's it. It might be before the radiator rather than after, I can't remember for sure. Either way, it's outside the inner coolant loop controlled by the thermostat.

What are you opinion about blauparts for the timing belt kit ? are they reliable for phaetons ?
Their rental toolkits are first-rate. Most of the tools were the genuine VW dealer tools. However, I'm guessing you can't rent them in Qatar.

I have heard occasional grumblings about the parts. I've put two Blauparts TB kits in my 2004 Passat V6, and the 2.8L V6 is of nearly identical design to the 4.2L V8. The first one had a premature tensioner failure. However, I could swear that tensioner was a genuine VW part with four rings on it, or a good counterfeit. It could have been installation error on my part. They do supply water pumps with metal impellers rather than plastic, which I like. The plastic ones have a rep for disintegrating and causing exactly the sort of problem you're having.

I do own a Phaeton, but it's a W12 model that doesn't use a timing belt.

The parts cost is vanishingly small compared to the labor involved. If you're at all worried, just get the parts from a local VW dealer.

Jason
 
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Without an Auto-Scan, I'm making an educated guess based on North American V8 Phaetons. Can you post one? In the meantime, try MVB location 134-4, shown as engine output temperature... I think that's it. It might be before the radiator rather than after, I can't remember for sure. Either way, it's outside the inner coolant loop controlled by the thermostat.

Thanks Jason. I'll try MVB location. Below is the latest output of the VCDS Scan I took few days back.

The first one had a premature tensioner failure. The parts cost is vanishingly small compared to the labor involved. If you're at all worried, just get the parts from a local VW dealer.

I'll go for genuine part then since the labor is inexpensive compared to U.S. The local dealer is a stealer with prices 3X times then normal. I found http://www.ezvwparts.com online and they seem to have good online discount.

Code:
Sunday,26,October,2014,22:06:54:33734
VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator
VCDS Version: 12.12.3.0
Data version: 20140822

VIN: WVWAG53D148010037   License Plate: 
Mileage: 78120km-48541mi   Repair Order: 
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Chassis Type: 3D (3D - VW Phaeton (2002 > 2006))
Scan: 01 02 03 05 06 07 08 09 11 13 15 16 17 18 19 23 27 28 29 2E
          34 36 37 38 39 46 47 55 56 57 65 66 68 69 71 75 76 77
 
VIN: WVWAG53D148010037   Mileage: 78120km/48541miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine        Labels: 4D0-907-560-BGH.lbl
   Part No SW: 4D0 907 560 CR    HW: 8E0 907 560 
   Component: 4.2L V8/5V      G   0020  
   Coding: 0026873
   Shop #: WSC 37704 001 1048576
   VCID: 78FF0BFB08508DDEA3D-5142
No fault code found.
Readiness: 0010 1101
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 02: Auto Trans        Labels: 09L-927-760.lbl
   Part No SW: 09L 927 760 B    HW: GS1 9.0 4.1 
   Component: AG6 09L 4,2L V8     1004  
   Coding: 0000101
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 3663C5C342C4BBAE711-5124
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 3D0-614-517.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 614 517 R
   Component: ESP 5.7 allrad  H33 0043  
   Coding: 0008376
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 3169F6DFABAA9C96243-5124
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 05: Acc/Start Auth.        Labels: 3D0-909-13x-05.lbl
   Part No SW: 3D0 909 135 L    HW: 5WK 470 22
   Component:    Kessy            6400  
   Coding: 0217324
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 2E53EDA3BA94836E391-5142
   Subsystem 1 - Part No: XXXXXXXXXXX 
   Component: ELV                 XXXX
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 06: Seat Mem. Pass        Labels: 3D0-959-759.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 959 759 B
   Component: Sitzmemory D1 BF    1520  
   Coding: 0000003
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 3561C2CF5FC2B0B678B-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 07: Control Head        Labels: 3D0-035-00x-07.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 035 007 N
   Component:    ZAB COCKPIT      0188  
   Coding: 0500135
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 24470F8BE458393EDF5-5142
1 Fault Found:
00857 - CD Changer Unit (R41) 
            003 - Mechanical Failure
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: 3D0-907-040.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 907 040 G
   Component: Climatronic D1      1144  
   Coding: 0000001
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 224B0993FE4C370EAD9-5124
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels: 3D0-937-049-V1.clb
   Part No: 3D0 937 049 G
   Component: STG.Bordnetz        5001  
   Coding: 0000011
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 2E53EDA3BA94836E391-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 3D0-909-601.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 909 601 E
   Component: 0J Airbag 8.4E+ H10 0935  
   Coding: 0012362
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 2541128FEF62C036C8B-5124
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 16: Steering wheel        Labels: 3D0-953-549.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 953 549 B
   Component: Lenksäulenmodul     3301  
   Coding: 0000032
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 2C57E7AB8C88F17E175-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 3D0-920-xxx-17.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 920 881 Q
   Component: KOMBIINSTRUMENT RB8 0421  
   Coding: 0008021
   Shop #: WSC 82600 826 177733
   VCID: 3467FFCB54B8A9BE4F5-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl
   Part No: 6N0 909 901 
   Component: Gateway K<>CAN      0101  
   Coding: 0000006
   Shop #: WSC 82600 826 177733
   VCID: F0EFB3DBE020559EEBD-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 28: HVAC, Rear        Labels: 3D0-919-158.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 919 158 F
   Component: Klima-Bedienteil D1 0117  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 2E53EDA3BA94836E391-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 29: Left Light        Labels: 3D0-909-157.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 909 157 
   Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(l)  X012  
   Coding: 0000001
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: E6C3D583D2E48B2E811-5124
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 34: Level Control        Labels: 3D0-907-553-V1.clb
   Part No: 3D0 907 553 B
   Component: LUFTFDR.-CDC- 3C1V0 1101  
   Coding: 0015500
   Shop #: WSC 60937 000 1048576
   VCID: 264315839264CB2EC11-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 36: Seat Mem. Drvr        Labels: 3D0-959-760.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 959 760 B
   Component: Sitzmemory D1 F     1520  
   Coding: 0000004
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 2D51EAAFB792F87600B-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 37: Navigation        Labels: 3D0-919-887.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 919 887 D
   Component:    NAVIGATION       0147  
   Coding: 0400000
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 3561C2CF5FC2B0B678B-5142
1 Fault Found:
00625 - Vehicle Speed Signal 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 38: Roof Electronics        Labels: 3D0-907-135.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 907 135 B
   Component: Dachmodul           0605  
   Coding: 0000042
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 224B0993FE4C370EAD9-5142
2 Faults Found:
00220 - Connection to Sunroof 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
00222 - Connection to Rain Sensor 
            004 - No Signal/Communication - Intermittent
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 39: Right Light        Labels: 3D0-909-158.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 909 158 
   Component: EVG GDL+AutoLWR(r)  X012  
   Coding: 0000001
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: E7DDD887D5EE9226BA7-517C
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 3D0-959-933.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 959 933 F
   Component: 0U HSG              0100  
   Coding: 0000034
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 3365FCD751B6AE8656F-4AE8
   Subsystem 1 - Part No: 3D1 959 701 E
   Component: Tuersteuergeraet FS 0104
   Subsystem 2 - Part No: 3D1 959 702 E
   Component: Tuersteuergeraet BF 0104
   Subsystem 3 - Part No: 3D0 959 703 E
   Component: Tuersteuergeraet HL 0104
   Subsystem 4 - Part No: 3D0 959 704 E
   Component: Tuersteuergeraet HR 0104
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 47: Sound System        Labels: 7Lx-035-4xx-47.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 035 466 
   Component: 12K-AUDIOVERST      0115  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: DFCDC0670DBEDAE6427-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 57: TV Tuner        Labels: 3D0-919-146.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 919 146 
   Component: TV Tuner        H07 1205  
   Coding: 0000010
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: E5C1D28F2FE2803688B-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 68: Wiper Electr.        Labels: 3Dx-955-1xx-V1.clb
   Part No: 3D1 955 119 
   Component: Front Wiper         2005  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: E6C3D583D2E48B2E811-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 71: Battery Charger        Labels: 3D0-915-181.lbl
   Part No: 3D0 915 181 B
   Component: Batteriemanagement  2600  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 224B0993FE4C370EAD9-5142
1 Fault Found:
00086 - Parallel Battery Connection Relay (J581) 
            011 - Open Circuit
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 76: Park Assist        Labels: None
   Part No: 3D0 919 283 C
   Component: 01 Einparkhilfe     0807  
   Shop #: WSC 00000 000 00000
   VCID: 2A5BE1B3867CEF4EE59-5142
No fault code found.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 77: Telephone        Labels: None
   Part No: 3D0 035 704 D
   Component: Telefon             8110  
   Shop #: WSC 01065 000 00000
   VCID: 1E333D63CA3413EE891-5124
1 Fault Found:
01522 - Handset for Telephone (R37) 
            004 - No Signal/Communication
End   ---------------------------------------------------------------------
 
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